Meeting between God Kabir and Dharamdas

Who was Dharamdas and how did he meet God Kabir?

Shri Dharmdas ji belonged to Baniya caste. He was a very rich man of Bandhavgarh (Madhya Pradesh, India). Since childhood, he was inclined towards bhakti. Due to which, he had made a Vaishnav Saint named Roopdas his guru (religious teacher). Being born in Hindu religion, Saint Roopdas ji used to advise Dharmdas to worship Ram, Krishna, Vishnu and Shankar. He had advised him to keep Ekadashi fast, go on pilgrimage, perform Shraadhs, offer Pind-Daan etc.

Dharamdas ji used to perform all the religious practices advised by Guru Roopdas ji with full devotion. Taking permission from Guru Roopdas ji, Dharmdas ji had gone to Mathura city for pilgrimage, to take sacred bath and to circumambulate the Giriraj (Govardhan) mountain.

2D Animation - Dharamdas and God Kabir (Hindi)

God Kabir Himself met Dharamdas in Mathura in the guise of a Jinda Mahatama.

Dharmdas took bath in the holy pond in which Shri Krishna used to take bath during his childhood. Then he brought a pot filled with water from that pond. He poured that water in the feet of a bronze statue of God Shri Krishna (Saligram), and then put it in another bowl. He made charnamrit (foot-nectar, a blessed drink) of it and drank it. Then he finished his ritual by giving bath to Saligram. Thereafter, he smeared a place, that is, he plastered a patch of ground with a mixture of some mud and cow dung. Then he spread a clean cloth on it and sat down to recite Shrimad Bhagavad Gita.

When Dharmdas was doing all this ritual, God Kabir, guised as Jinda, was watching him sitting at a distance. Dharamdas ji was also noticing that a Muslim saint is attentively watching all his devotional acts. He thought that - 'It seems that he has been fascinated by our Hindu religious practices.' Therefore, Dharamdas started reciting Shrimad Bhagavad Gita loudly and also started reading the Hindi translation. Supreme God got up and came and sat down near Dharmdas. Dharmdas felt that his intuition was right. Therefore, that day he read several chapters of Gita, and also narrated their translation.

When Dharmdas finished his daily ritual of worship, God Kabir said, "Mahatma ji, what is your good name? Which caste do you belong to? Which place are you from? Which religion/sect are you associated with? Please tell me. I liked your knowledge a lot. Impart some knowledge of bhakti to me too. I would be highly obliged."

Dharamdas ji replied: - 'My name is Dharmdas. I am from Bandhavgarh and belong to Vaishya caste. I am initiated from Vaishnav sect. I have taken birth in Hindu religion. I have taken initiation from Vaishnav sect with full determination and after properly understanding this knowledge. My gurudev is Shri Roopdas ji. I am well-versed with spiritual knowledge. I do not get influenced by anyone else. I worship Ram-Krishna, who are incarnations of Shri Vishnu, and God Shankar. I keep fast of Ekadashi. I go on pilgrimages and do charity there. I worship Saligram every day. This is the Holy Book Shrimad Bhagavad Gita. I read it daily. I also carry out Shraadhs of my deceased ancesters. I also offer Pind-daan. I do not kill any living being. I do not consume meat, alcohol or tobacco.'

Question: - Supreme God Kabir asked - 'The book you were reading, what is its name?'

Answer: - Dharamdas said, 'This is Shrimad Bhagavad Gita. We remain pure. We do not allow a person of a lower caste come near us.'

Question:- (of God Kabir in Jinda form) What (naam) mantras do you chant?

Answer: - (of Dharamdas) I chant Hare Krishna, Krishna-Krishna Hare-Hare, Om NamH Shivay, Om Bhagvate Vasudevay NamH, RadheRadhe Shyam Miladey, Gayatri mantra 108 times daily. I also chant Vishnu Sahansrnaam.

Question:- (of Jinda Baba) O Mahatma Dharmdas! Who gave the knowledge of Gita?

Answer :- (of Dharmdas) The Master of the lineage, the Almighty God Shri Krishna. He himself is Shri Vishnu.

Question:- (of God in Jinda Baba form) Your venerable deity is Shri Krishna i.e. Shri Vishnu. The knowledge of Bhakti given by him is Holy Book Gita.

O Dharamdas! A farmer had a son in his old age. The farmer thought that - 'By the time my son will become capable of doing farming, I would have died.' Therefore, he wrote the method of farming and his experience in a register. He told his son that - 'Son! When you grow up, read this experience of mine written in this register time and again. Sow the crop according to this.' After some days, the father died. The son started reading his father's experience every day, but he used to act contrary to that experience in terms of the seed of crop, sowing the crop, irrigation etc. Would that son then succeed in his task of farming?

Answer: - (of Dharamdas) The son would become poor in this way. He must do every job according to the experience written by his father. He is a foolish son.

Question: - (of God in Baba Jinda form) O Dharamdas! Holy Book Gita is the experience of your Supreme Father God Krishna alias Vishnu and his order to you that - 'On reading my experience written in this Holy Book Gita, if you will do bhakti according to it, then you will attain salvation.'

• Are you doing bhakti according to Shri Krishna's order written in Gita?
• Are those mantras written in Gita that your Guru has given you to chant (Hare Ram - Hare Ram, Ram-Ram Hare-Hare, Hare Krishna - Hare Krishna, Krishna-Krishna Hare-Hare, Om NamH Shivay, Om Bhagvate Vasudevay NamH, Radhe-Radhe Shyam Miladey, Gayatri Mantra and Vishnu Sahansrnam)?
• Is there order in Gita to keep fast of Ekadashi, carry out shraadhs, perform Pind-daan?

Answer: - (of Dharmdas) No, there is not.

Question: - (of Supreme God) Then you are behaving like that son of farmer, whom you have called foolish, who disobeying his father's order, is proving his foolishness by acting arbitrarily and sowing wrong seed at the wrong time. Are you less foolish than that son of farmer?

Dharmdas said - O Jinda! You are a Muslim Fakir (saint). Therefore, you are calling the acts of worship of our Hindu religion and the mantras to be wrong.

Answer: (of God Kabir in Jinda form) O Swami Dharmdas ji! I am not saying anything. Your religious texts are saying that. The religious gurus of your religion, making you relinquish the scripture-based way of worship, are making you follow arbitrary practices.

One will only get benefit by doing the acts of bhakti that are mentioned in these scriptures.

Dharmdas: - O Jinda! You may shut up. I can't hear this anymore.

Supreme God appeared in Jinda form said, "O Vaishnav Mahatma Dharmdas! Truth is as bitter as Neem (Indian Lilac), but a sick person must take bitter medicine even when unwilling to do so. It is in his or her best interest. If you are getting annoyed, then I will leave. Saying this, God (in Jinda form) disappeared.

Dharamdas was shaken when God Kabir disappeared for the first time

Dharamdas became astonished and thought that - 'He was not an ordinary saint. He seemed to be a fully knowledgeable person with spiritual powers. Despite being a Muslim, he had complete knowledge of Hindu scriptures. He could be a demi-god.' Internally, Dharmdas was realising that he was doing worship contrary to the Holy Book Gita, but he was not accepting it out of ego. When God  disappeared, he got completely shattered thinking that - 'My way of worship is contrary to Gita. I am violating the orders of God. My guru Shri Roopdas ji is also not aware of the actual way of worship. Now doing or not doing this bhakti is same; it is useless.' He started looking here and there with a very heavy heart, and started calling out from his heart that - 'How stupid I am. Even after seeing the whole truth, I lost the God-like Mahatma because of my foolishness and stubbornness. O God! If I find the same saint once again, quitting my stubbornness, I will humbly understand the entire knowledge.' After praying several times in the day, he slept at night. He kept tossing and turning the whole night. He kept thinking - "O God! What has happened? All the religious practices I am performing are against the scriptures. That angel has opened my eyes. I am 60 years old. Now I do not know if I will find that angel (in Jinda form) again or not."

Dharamdas got up early next morning. At first, he started preparing food. He did not perform any religious ritual that day. He had brought some fire wood from the jungle the previous day. Burning them in the stove, he started preparing food. One piece of wood was thick. It was hollow from inside. It had several ants inside it. After burning, when only a small portion of the firewood was left, Dharmdas could see its rear part. He saw that some sap was boiling on the end of that wood. The ants were trying to get out of it, but were dying by falling into the boiling sap. Some were dying by burning in the front end of the wood. Dharmdas thought - "This firewood has been burning for a while and many ants have died in it." He extinguished the fire immediately. He started thinking that - "I won't eat this sinful food. I will feed this to some sage or saint, and I will keep a fast. My sins will lessen by doing so." Contemplating this, keeping all the food in one plate, he set out in search of a sage.

Supreme God Kabir assumed a different attire like that of a Hindu saint and sat down under a tree. Dharmdas saw the sage and keeping the plate of food in front of him, said, "O Mahatma! Please have food." God in the form of sage said, "Give it to me, Dharamdas. I am hungry." Dharamdas got suprised on being addressed by his name, but ignored it. God in sage form took some water in his hand from his pot, and reciting some speech from his mouth, sprinkled the water over the food. The entire food converted into ants. The plate became black with ants. The ants with their eggs in their mouth were trying to get out of the plate. God also acquired his same Jinda appearance, and said, "O Dharmdas Vaishnav Saint! You were saying that you don't kill any living being! Even a butcher is less violent than you. You have killed millions of living beings." Instantly, Dharmdas fell to the sage's feet, and asked for forgiveness for the previous day's mistake, and prayed, "O Lord! Please forgive the ignorant me. I have nowhere to go, because the previous way of worship is completely against the scriptures. There is no benefit of doing it. You have proved this from Gita itself. Only you can tell from whom I can get the scripture-based way of worship. I am eager to listen to the entire spiritual knowledge from you. Kindly show grace to this servant and narrate that knowledge to me by which I can attain salvation."

What does Gita Say about Keeping Fasts?

Supreme God (in Jinda form) said, "O Dharmdas! You keep fast of Ekadashi. In Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 6 Verse 16, it has been forbidden; it is stated that - 'O Arjun! This bhakti is neither successful of one who eats excessively, nor of one who does not eat at all, that is, neither this bhakti is successful of a person who keeps fasts, nor of someone who sleeps too much, nor of someone who remains awake a lot.' It is completely forbidden in this verse to keep fast. Open your Gita and look in it.

Dharmdas also remembered the verses of Gita because he used to read them daily. Nevertheless, he thought that the Jinda saint might get upset; therefore, he opened Gita and read Chapter 6 Verse 16, and admitted that - 'You have opened my eyes, Jinda. You seem to be a figure of God.'

What does Gita Say about Shraadh and Pind-daan?

You carry out Shraadhs and perform Pind-daan. In Gita Chapter 9 Verse 25, it has been clarified that those who worship ghosts will go to ghosts. Carrying out shraadhs and performing Pind-daan is worship of ghosts. This is a useless religious practice.

Sage Ruchi's Ved-opinion on Shraadh & Pind-daan

In Markandey Puran, there is a story of "(Rachya Rishi ke Janm) Birth of Sage Rauchya". There was a Sage Ruchi. While practising celibacy, he used to worship according to the Vedas. He was a bachelor.

Sage Ruchi's father, grandfather, great grandfather and great-great grandfather, all were wandering hungry and thirsty in the lives of Pitras/ manes (ghosts). One day, all four of them appeared before sage Ruchi and said, "Son! Why did you not get married? Get married and carry out our Shraadhs."

Sage Ruchi said, "O Pitamaho (grandfathers)! In Vedas, these shraadhs etc have been called Avidya (ignorance), acts of fools. Then why are you asking me to perform this act?"

Pitras said, "It is true that in Vedas, acts like Shraadhs etc have been called Avidya (ignorance), that is, acts of fools."

Then those Pitras imparting knowledge contrary to the Vedas misled Sage Ruchi because affection is also a root of ignorance. It has been proved from the account of Markandey Puran that in Vedas and in Gita, the summary of Vedas, Shraadh and Pind-daan etc worship of ghosts have been prohibited. They should not be done.

Those foolish sages even compelled their son to perform shraadhs. He got married. From that, Sage Rauchya was born. They made their son also a partner in sin.

Gayatri Mantra

Like, you chant the Gayatri Mantra; it is Yajurved's Chapter 36 Mantra 3. It doesn't have word "Om" in front of it. If the word "Om" is added to this Ved mantra, then it is an insult to God because the word "Om" is for worship of Brahm. In Yajurved Chapter 36 Mantra 3, there is glory of Supreme God. If an ignorant person is writing a letter to the Prime Minister and is writing - To, "The Chief Minister", then he is insulting the Prime Minister.

As far as repeated recitation of this mantra of Yajurved Chapter 36 Mantra 3 is concerned, this act does not lead to salvation.

The original text of the mantra is as follows: -

BhoorbhavH swaH tat savitu vareniyam bhrigo devasya dheemahi dheeyo yonH prachodyaat ||

Translation of words: - (BhooH) Self-existent God (bhavH) creates Earth and Golok etc structures with word (swaH) Heaven etc are places of comforts. (Tat) He (SavituH) is the Father God of all. (Vareniyam) He is worthy of being selected by all the worshippers, that is, He is worthy of being worshipped by the virtuous souls. (Bhrigo) Effulgent i.e. bright (devasya) of God (dheemahi) with high opinion i.e. with great wisdom (Dhee yo naH prachodyaat) who analyses like intellectuals, that prudent person becomes eligible for salvation.

Translation: - The Self-existent God creates Earth and Golok etc structures with word. Heaven etc are places of comforts. He is the Father God of all. He is worthy of being selected by all the worshippers, that is, He is worthy of being worshipped by the virtuous souls. One who analyses the effulgent God with great wisdom like intellectuals, that prudent person becomes eligible for salvation.

Meaning: - The Self-existent God is the Creator of all the worlds like Earth, Golok etc and Heaven. Supreme devotees must worship that effulgent God with this thing in mind that we should worship Him who is (Purushottam) the Greatest God, who is superior to all gods, who is giver of the abode of happiness, that is, giver of all the happiness.

This is the Hindi translation and meaning of the abovementioned mantra. Salvation is not possible by only reading its Sanskrit or Hindi translation because it is only a part of the magnificence of God, that is, this Yajurved Chapter 36 Mantra 3 is just one mantra out of thousands of Ved mantras. If someone even keeps reading all the four Vedas, then also salvation is not possible.

Salvation will be attained by doing bhakti according to the knowledge given in the Vedas.

Question: - (of Dharmdas) O Jinda! I do not even know which knowledge in Gita is for attainment of salvation. I have read Gita, but I have not understood it. The way of worship which our religious gurus have advised, we have been doing it with devotion. The way of worship contrary to the scriptures that has been prevalent for years seems to be true to all the devotees. Is the way of worship written in Gita sufficient?

Answer (of Jinda Baba/Saint): - In Gita, only the way of worship upto the level of Brahm has been mentioned. For complete salvation, one will have to worship Param Akshar Brahm. The complete method is not in Gita; there is only an indication. Like, in Gita Chapter 17 Verse 23, it is stated that - "For the attainment of Sachidanand Ghan Brahm i.e. Param Akshar Brahm i.e. Supreme God, there is instruction of this mantra "Om Tat Sat". It is mentally chanted in three ways. In this mantra, "Om", which is a mantra of Kshar Purush i.e. Brahm, is clear, but the mantra of "Par Brahm" (Akshar Purush) is "Tat" which is coded; only a Tatvdarshi saint tells it to a disciple. "Sat" this mantra is of Purna Brahm (Param Akshar Brahm) and is coded; this also is only told by a Tatvdarshi saint to a disciple.

A Tatvdarshi Saint has the path of complete salvation

A Tatvdarshi Saint has the path of complete salvation with him that is not even in the Vedas, neither in Gita, nor in Purans, nor in any Upnishad. Gita and Vedas are helpful in proving the authenticity of Tatvgyan. The way of worship that is in Vedas and Gita is also present in Tatvgyan. Not only Sukshmved i.e. Tatvgyan has the way of worship of the Vedas and Gita, but apart from that it also has the way of worship of complete salvation.

Question: - (of Dharmdas) Where is the evidence in Gita and Vedas that the path of complete salvation is only with a Tatvdarshi Saint, not in Vedas or Gita? O Lord Jinda! Please resolve my doubt. Your knowledge touches my heart. It is indeed true, but only seeing is believing.

Answer: - (of Jinda Supreme God) In Gita Chapter 4 Verse 25 to 30, the speaker of the knowledge of Gita has said that -

• 'O Arjun! All the worshippers perform their religious practices considering them to be destroyer of sins, that is, giver of salvation. If they had this certitude that the worship they are doing is not in accordance with the scriptures, they would leave the worship. Like, many worshippers consider worship to be the performance of religious rituals of gods. Others only worship Brahm. Many perform religious ritual by pouring ghee into fire; it is called Hawan.' (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 25)
• Other devotees perform rituals by closing eyes, ears and mouth. They sacrifice, that is, end their human life in that only. (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 26)
• Other devotees worship by focussing their attention on the incoming and the outgoing air while breathing; they sacrifice, that is, end their life in the fire of practice of self-retraint. They consider their way of worship to be the lamp of knowledge, that is, to be the best. (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 27)
• Some other devotees perform yagyas, that is, religious rituals through money e.g. provide (bhandara) free food to laymen, distribute clothes and blankets, build inns and free water-kiosks etc. They perform these yagyas. Some do religious austerity (meditate); some perform Yogasanas. They consider these to be the way of worship for attaining God. Many worshippers practice strict vows of non-violence e.g. covering the mouth with a piece of cloth and walking barefoot, fasting for several days etc. Other devotees do self-study, that is, they daily read some (mantras) verses from a holy book like Ved; this is called Gyan Yagya. They believe that these practices lead to salvation. (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 28)
• Other devotees perform the action of offering their incoming air to the outgoing air. Contrary to this, some devotees peform the action of offering the outgoing air to the incoming air. Many worshippers restrict their food intake. Some perform activities like Yog etc. For example, worshippers, who are engrossed in Pranayam, stopping the flow of incoming and outgoing air reduce their breaths. They sacrifice, that is, dedicate their human life to this alone. All these abovementioned (Chapter 4 Verses 25 to 30) worshippers by performing their respective yagyas, that is, religious rituals believe that they are peforming a religious practice that destroys sins. (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 30)
• If the way of worship of the worshipper is according to the scriptures, then O best of Kurus, Arjun! The worshippers, who eat the blessed food from this Yagya, attain the Eternal Brahm, that is, Param Akshar Brahm, and for those, who do not perform Yagya, that is, scripture-based way of worship, even this earth is not pleasurable, then how can (Parlok) another world be enjoyable, meaning that scripture opposed worshipper does not get any benefit. This evidence is also in Gita Chapter 16 Verse 23-24. (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 31)

The speaker of Gita has clarified in the verses 25 to 30 above that whatever worship a worshipper is doing, he/she is doing it considering it to be true and the giver of salvation. But in Verse 32 of Gita Chapter 4 itself, he has told that - "(BrahmnH Mukhe) Param Akshar Brahm imparts the true knowledge of the yagyas, that is, religious rituals by himself uttering from his lotus-mouth. {It is called the speech of the Sachidanand Ghan Brahm (True-happiness-giving God), that is, Param Akshar Brahm. It is also called Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge). It is also called the Fifth Ved (Sukshm Ved).} The way of worship has been described in detail in that Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge). Knowing it, a worshipper becomes free from all the sins, that is, attains complete salvation.

- In Gita Chapter 4 Verse 34, the speaker of Gita has stated that you may understand that knowledge (the knowedge that God imparts by uttering from his lotus-mouth, the Tatvgyan) by going to Tatvdarshi saints. By prostrating before them, and politely asking questions without any deceit, those Tatvdarshi saints will give you instruction of Tatvgyan.

- This also proves that the knowledge of Gita is not complete, but it is also not wrong. Even the Giver of the knowledge of Gita does not have the knowledge of the path of complete salvation because the Giver of the knowledge of Gita does not have the information about the Tatvgyan which God (Param Akshar Brahm) utters from his mouth. He has advised to know it from the Tatvdarshi saints.

- This very evidence is also given in Yajurved Chapter 40 Mantra 10. It is said that some consider the Param Akshar Brahm to be "Sambhavat", that is, 'to be born in form' like Ram-Krishna. Some consider him "Asambhavat", that is, 'God is not born; He is formless'. Whether God takes birth or not; what is He actually like? "Dheeranam" Tatvdarshi saints give this knowledge. Listen to them.

Question 36 : - (of Dharmdas) O Lord! O Jinda! What is the identity of a Tatvdarshi Saint and where is the evidence in the certified holy books? Your knowledge is piercing my soul. Listening to the word by word actual meaning of Gita from your lotus-mouth, my thirsty soul for eras is getting quenched; it is feeling ecstatic.

Answer (of Jinda Supreme God) Supreme God said that - 'First, listen to the characteristics of a Tatvdarshi Saint, that is, of a fully knowledgeable Satguru:-

Guru ke lakshan chaar bakhana, pratham ved shastra ko gyana (gyata) |
Doojey Hari bhakti man karm baani, teesrey samdrishti kar jaani |
Chauthey ved vidhi sab karma, yeh chaar guru gun jano marma |

These nectar-speeches are lettered in Kabir Sagar, Chapter "Jeev Dharm Bodh" on Page 1960.

Meaning: - A Tatvdarshi Saint (Complete Satguru) has four main characteristics:-

1. He is a complete scholar of the Vedas and all other holy books.
2. He himself does the worship of God with mind-action-word; he is not merely a speaker. There is no difference in his actions and speech.
3. He looks equally upon all the disciples. He does not discriminate on the basis of superiority or inferiority.
4. Fourth - He himself does and gets done all the acts of bhakti (worship) according to the Vedas, that is, he does and makes others do scripture-based worship.

This above mentioned evidence is given in Sukshm Ved that Supreme God has uttered from his lotus-mouth.

Identity of Tatvadarshi Saint in Bhagavad Gita

Now I will show you evidence from Shrimad Bhagavad Gita that what the identity of a Tatvdarshi Saint is.

It is clear in Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 15 Verse 1 that -

Oordhav moolam adhH shaakhm ashvattham praahuH avyyam |
Chhandasi yasya prnaani yaH tam ved saH vedvit || (15/1)

Translation :- With roots above and the three gunas-like branches below, consider this inverted tree to be world-like Peepal tree; it is called immortal. Because the cycle of creation-destruction continues forever, it is called immortal. The leaves etc are the parts of this world-like tree. (Ya Tam Ved) He who knows all the parts of this world-like tree in essence, (SaH) he (Vedvit) knows the purport of the Vedas, that is, he is a Tatvdarshi saint.

Like, in Gita Chapter 4 Verse 32, it is stated that the Param Akshar Brahm himself appearing on earth utters the Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge) in detail from his lotus-mouth.

Supreme God has said in his speech, i.e, in Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge): -

Kabir, Akshar Purush ek ped hai, Kshar Purush vaaki daar |
Teeno deva shaakha hain, paat roop sansaar ||

Meaning: - The part of the tree which is outside the ground is called trunk. Consider this trunk to be Akshar Purush. Many thick branches arise from the trunk. Consider one of those thick branches to be Kshar Purush. Three branches arise from that thick branch. Consider them to be the three gods (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun ShivShankar), and these branches bear leaves; consider those leaves to be the world.

In Gita Chapter 15 Verses 1 to 4, there is an indicative decription. It has been described in detail in Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge).

Let us first understand from the knowledge of Gita itself. In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 2, it is stated that - 'The world-like tree has the three gunas-like (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shankar) branches. They are extended above (in heaven) and below (in Nether world).'

Note: - Rajgun is Brahma, Satgun is Vishnu and Tamgun is Shankar. See the evidence in Question no.7. 'The three gunas-like branches are extended above and below' - its meaning is that the knowledge of Gita was being delivered on Earth. The authority of the three gods is in the three worlds - 1. Heaven 2. Earth and 3. Nether world. These three gods are ministers of one department each. Shri Brahma is minister of Rajgun department, Shri Vishnu is minister of Satgun department and Shri Shiv is minister of Tamgun department.

- In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 3, it is stated that - 'O Arjun! The form of this world-like tree cannot be perceived here, that is, in this discussion of the knowledge of Gita between you and me; meaning I won't be able to tell because I do not have adequate knowledge about its beginning and end. Therefore, severing this world-like tree which has a very firm root (that God is also immortal and his place, Satyalok, Alakh Lok, Agam Lok and Akah Lok, these four upper loks are also indestructible. The same God assuming different appearances is seated on a throne in these four loks. Therefore, he is called "Sudridmoolam", that is, one with very firm  foundation) with the weapon of Tatvgyan, that is, by understanding Tatvgyan from a Tatvdarshi saint.'

- Then in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 4, it is stated that - 'Thereafter one should search for that supreme state, that is, Satyalok of the Supreme God; having gone where, worshippers do not return to this world. The Supreme God from whom the world-like tree has expanded, that is, the Supreme God who has created the entire world.'

First, understand the way of worship of that very Supreme God from a Tatvdarshi Saint. The speaker of Gita is even forbidding his own worship.

In Gita Chapter 15 Verses 16-17, three gods have been mentioned.

• In Verse 16, two gods have been mentioned - Kshar Purush and Akshar Purush - these two are mortal.
• In Verse 17, the third God has been mentioned - Param Akshar Purush - who is the root (origin) of the world-like tree. In reality, He is immortal. All the parts of a tree, "trunk, branches, shoots, leaves", get nourishment from the root only. That Param Akshar Purush only by entering the three worlds sustains and nurtures everyone. One should only worship that (root/original) Master.

The identity of a Tatvdarshi Saint (Complete Satguru) and the ignorance, that is, lack of Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge) of the Speaker of Gita is clear in this description.

"Disappearance of Jinda Baba for the Second Time"

Dharmdas said: - 'O Jinda! What are you saying that Shri Vishnu is only a minister of a department in the three worlds? You are wrong. Shri Vishnu is the lord of the entire brahmand (universe). He only in the form of Shri Brahma does the creation. In the form of Vishnu, he sustains the world, and assuming the form of Shiv, causes destruction. He is the Master of the lineage. If you insult Shri Vishnu again, then it will not be right.'

Supreme God Kabir said: -

Murkh key samjhaavtey, gyan gaanthi ka jaay |
Koyla hot na ujla, bhaavein sau man saabun laay ||

Saying this, Supreme God in Jinda form disappeared. After losing the Supreme God the second time, Dharmdas became very upset. His faith in God Vishnu was so firm that even on seeing the evidence with his own eyes, he was not ready to forsake falsehood.

Kabir, jaan boojh saachi tajae, karey jhooth se neh |
Taaki sangati hey Prabhu, swapan mein bhi na deh ||

After a while, the shadow of Kaal drew away from Dharmdas's intellect and he reflected on his mistake that all the evidence were shown from Gita itself. Jinda Baba did not say anything from his side. How unfortunate I am that I lost a God-like Tatvdarshi Saint due to my adamant behaviour. Now I will not find that God. My life will be wasted. Thinking this, Dharmdas shuddered with fear. He started eating less, remained sad and started praying in his heart - 'O Lord! O Jinda Baba! Grant me one more audience. I will never repeat such a mistake in future. I pray to you with folded hands. Please ignore this fool's absurd statements. Meet me again, Lord. Your knowledge is true; you are true; your every word is nectar. Kindly grant me an audience, otherwise I will not survive.'

On the third day, Supreme God Kabir was sitting under a tree on the bank of a river. Some stray cows were also ruminating nearby sitting under that same tree. Some were grazing on the bank of the river. Dharmdas's eyes fell on the saint clad in yellow clothes sitting on the bank of the river. He saw that cows are grazing nearby. It seemed to him as if God Krishna had himself come from his Lok (world/place) and sat there. Dharmdas eagerly went to the saint and saw that he was some ordinary saint. Nevertheless, he thought that - 'Let me touch his feet and then move forward.' When Dharmdas touched the saint's feet and kept his head on his feet, he felt as if he had touched cotton. Then, when he pressed the feet with his hands, he found that there was no bone in them. When he looked up at the face, the same Baba Jinda was sitting in the previous attire. Dharmdas firmly held his feet so that he does not go away and asked for forgivesness for his mistake. He said, "O Jinda! You are a Tatvdarshi Saint. I am a misled curious person. Until my doubts are resolved, how can my ignorance be dispelled? You are highly merciful. Have mercy on this servant. Dispel my ignorance, Lord.'

Question 37 (of Dharmdas): - O Jinda! If Shri Vishnu is not the Complete God, then who is Complete God? Please give evidence from Gita.

Answer: - That God is "Param Akshar Brahm" who is the Master of the lineage.

Evidence: - is in Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 15 Verses 1 to 4 and 16-17. The summary or meaning of Gita Chapter 15 Verses 1 to 4 is that - 'Consider the world to be like an upside-down hanging tree. Like the roots of the tree are above, and consider the three gunas-like branches to be below.' In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 1, this has also been clarified that - 'What is the identity of a Tatvadarshi Saint?' A Tatvadarshi Saint is he who distinctly tells all the parts of the world-like tree.

Important: - The photocopies of the Ved mantras that have been further attached have been translated by the Acharyas and Maharishi Dayanand of Arya Samaj, and published by the Sarvadeshik Arya Pratinidhi Sabha, Delhi. It is described in them that the Supreme God, by Himself appearing on earth in His body, behaving like poets, utters the true spiritual knowledge. (Evidence is given in Rigved Mandal no. 9 Sukt 86 Mantra 26-27; Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 82 Mantra 1-2; Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 96 Mantra 16 to 20; Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 94 Mantra 1; Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 95 Mantra 2; Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 20 Mantra 1; Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 54 Mantra 3) It is mentioned in these Mantras that God is situated in the Lok (world) which is above all the loks (worlds). Whenever unrighteousness rises due to an upsurge in ignorance on earth, God Himself walks from there and appears in a body on earth and behaving like poets, spreads the true spiritual knowledge through proverbs, hymns, quatrains, verses, poems etc. by roaming around. Due to which, He also acquires the title of a famous poet. Please see the photocopies of the abovementioned Mantras on page 109 to 123.

God had narrated the knowledge by uttering from His lotus-mouth. It is called Sukshm Ved. It is also called 'Tatv Gyan' (True Spiritual Knowledge). Because of disseminating the Tatvgyan, God also becomes known as a "Tatvdarshi Saint". That God who appeared in the form of a Tatvdarshi Saint described all the parts of the world-like tree in this way: -

Kabir, Akshar Purush ek vriksh hai, Kshar Purush vaaki daar |
Teeno deva shaakha hain, paat roop sansaar ||

Meaning: - The part of the tree that is visible outside the ground is called trunk. Like, the trunk of the world-like tree is Akshar Purush. A big branch originates from the trunk. Consider it to be Kshar Purush. Imagine three branches to be originating from the big branch. Consider them to be the three gods (Rajgun Brahma ji, Satgun Vishnu ji and Tamgun Shiv ji), and consider the shoots and leaves on these branches to be the world. The abovementioned parts of the world-like tree are visible outside the ground. The roots are under the ground. All the parts of the tree get nourishment from the roots. In Gita Chapter 15 Verses 16-17, three Purushs (Gods) have been mentioned. In Verse 16, two Purushs (Gods) have been mentioned - "Kshar Purush and Akshar Purush". The state of both of them has been mentioned above. In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 16 also, it has been mentioned that Kshar Purush and Akshar Purush, both are mortal. All the living beings under them are also mortal. But no one's soul dies. In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 17, it is mentioned that the Uttam Purush (Supreme God), that is, Purushottam is different from Kshar Purush and Akshar Purush. He is called God. Information about this very God has been given in Gita Chapter 8 Verse 3, where he has been called "Param Akshar Brahm". In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 17 also, there is mention of Him only. This very God sustains everyone by entering into the three worlds. In reality, He is the Immortal God. A tree is nourished by the roots only; therefore, He who sustains everyone is Param Akshar Brahm. Like, previously, it has been described in Gita Chapter 15 Verses 1-4 that the world-like tree has the roots (origin) above and the branches below. A tree gets the nourishment from the roots only. Therefore, Param Akshar Brahm, who is the root (origin) of the worldlike tree, is the sustainer, that is, the Creator of all the Purushs (Gods). He is the Master of the lineage.

Question 38: - Dharmdas asked - 'Should one worship Shri Vishnu and Shankar?'

Answer (of Jinda Baba): - No, one should not.

Question 39 (of Dharmdas): - Please give evidence from Gita.

Answer: - - Evidence is present in Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 7 Verses 12 to 15, 20 to 23 and Gita Chapter 9 Verses 23-24.

- In Gita Chapter 7 Verses 12 to 15, it is mentioned that - 'those people who worship Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv, they, with demoniac nature, lowest among men, who perform evil deeds, fools, do not even worship me.' (This evidence is present in Gita Chapter 7 Verse 12 to 15. A similar thing has been mentioned in the same Gita Chapter 7 Verses 20 to 23 and in Gita Chapter 9 Verse 23-24. Except Kshar Purush, Akshar Purush and Param Akshar Purush who are mentioned in Gita Chapter 15 Verses 16-17, Shri Brahma ji, Shri Vishnu ji and Shri Shiv ji are counted in the other gods.)

In both these Chapters (in Gita Chapter 7 and Chapter 9), in the verses mentioned above, the Speaker of the knowledge of Gita has stated that - 'Whichever worshipper with whatever objective worships the other gods, he or she worships them considering them to be God. I have granted some power to these gods. Those who worship the gods obtain some benefits ordained by me. But that fruit of those dim-witted people is perishable. Those who worship gods go to the worlds of gods. My worshippers attain me.'

- It is stated in Gita Chapter 16 Verse 23-24 that - 'Abandoning the injunctions of the scriptures, the worshippers who behave arbitrarily, that is, worship the gods, pitras, yakshas, bhairo, ghosts, and chant fictitious mantras, neither do they get any happiness, nor any (siddhi) spiritual success, nor do they get any salvation. Therefore, O Arjun! For you, in the determination of what should be done (way of worship that should be followed) and what should not be done (the way of worship that should not be followed), scriptures are the evidence.'

- In Gita Chapter 17 Verse 1, Arjun asked that - 'O Krishna! (because Arjun was believing that Shri Krishna is himself imparting the knowledge, but Kaal (Brahm) entering into Shri Krishna's body like a ghost was uttering the knowledge that has been proved previously) Those who abandoning the injunctions of the scriptures worship the other gods, what is their nature like?' The speaker of the knowledge of Gita replied that Satvik people worship the gods, Rajsi people worship the yakshas and demons, and Tamsi people worship ghosts etc. All these acts are against the injunctions of the scriptures.

- Then in Gita Chapter 17 Verse 5-6, it is stated that - 'Those people, who practice arbitrary severe religious austerity which is not enjoined by the scriptures, are ostentatious, and consider them to be ignorants with demoniac nature who torture the powers situated in the lotuses of their bodies and me.'

Even Supreme God has stated in the Sukshm Ved that: -

Kabir, mai masaani sedh sheetla bhairav bhoot hanumant |
Parmatma se nyara rahae, jo inko poojant ||

Ram bhajae to Ram milae, dev bhajae so dev |
Bhoot bhajae so bhoot bhavae, suno sakal sur bhev ||

It has become clear that one should not worship Shri Brahma ji (Rajgun), Shri Vishnu ji (Satgun) and Shri Shiv ji (Tamgun), and along with these, one should also not worship ghosts, Pitras (Shraadh ritual, Teranhvi, Pindodak ritual- all these are worship of ghosts), Bhairav and Hanuman ji.

On seeing cogent evidence from holy book Gita, Dharmdas was awstruck as if he had suffered a shock. He couldn't tell  a lie, and it was going to take time to accept it.

Supreme God in Jinda form, addressing Dharmdas, said that - 'O Vaishnav Mahatma! In which world have you gone; come back.' As if Dharmdas woke up from slumber. Becoming alert, he said, "Nothing, nothing. Please narrate more knowledge so that my misconception can be dispelled."

Supreme God Kabir narrated the "Creation of Nature" to Dharmdas.

Listening to the "Creation of Nature", Dharmdas felt as if he would turn insane because whatever knowledge he had heard to date from the Hindu religious gurus, sages, Maharishis, saints etc was seeming baseless and uncertified. Jinda Baba was proving from the Holy Hindu Texts only. There was no room for doubt. He was thinking to himself that he might turn insane.

Question 40 (of Dharmdas):- O Jinda! Do the gurus and sages of Hindu religion not have the knowledge of the scriptures?

Answer (of Jinda Mahatma): - Is there still a need a tell this?

Dharmdas's Discussion of Knowledge with the Other Saints

Question 41 (of Dharmdas):- Dharmdas thought that - 'How can it be possible that none of the saints, gurus and Maharishis of Hindu religion know the true spiritual knowledge?'

Saying this, Dharamdas thought that - 'I should seek knowledge from some Mahamandleshwar (highly renowned saint). What will I get from a wandering fakir (saint)?' Dharmdas was just thinking this when Supreme God in Jinda-form knowing his faulty thoughts said that - 'You may gain knowledge from your Mahamandleshwars.' Saying this, God disappeared the third time. Dharmdas was taken aback and felt very ashamed when he heard about the faulty thought in his mind from Jinda Mahatma.

When God disappeared, he became distraught. But Dharamdas was hopeful that - 'I will definitely find Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge) with our Mahamandleshwars. Accepting the way of worship considering the knowledge of Jinda Baba (Muslim) to be the (Tatvgyan) complete spiritual knowledge is like converting oneself to another religion. This would be a subject of criticism in the society. Therefore, it would be appropriate to follow supreme scripture-based way of worship after gaining Tatvgyan from our Hindu Mahatmas.' This time, the sudden departure of Jinda Baba did not bother Dharmdas much because he had a misconception; he thought that - 'Hinduism is such a massive and ancient religion, would I not find a single Tatvdarshi saint?'

Dharamdas went to meet Shri Gyananand ji

Dharamdas went to the ashram of a Vaishnav Mahamandleshwar, Shri Gyananand ji Vaishnav. At that time, Shri Gyananand ji was very famous. He was a disciple of Swami Ramanand ji of Kashi. But at that time, Swami Ramanand ji had become a disciple/guru of Supreme God Kabir. He had accepted his knowledge to be ignorance. Swami Ramanand ji had told all his sage-disciples that - 'The knowledge imparted by me is useless, and the way of worship is against the holy scriptures. You may all take initiation from Supreme God Kabir.' But the arrogance of caste, prestige among disciples, heap of ignorance instead of knowledge, do not allow one to accept the truth.

Kabir, raaj tajna sahaj hai, sahaj triya ka neh | Maan badaayi irshya, durlabh tajna yeh ||

Dharmdas questioned Shri Gyananand ji - 'Swami ji, is there any God above God Vishnu?'

Shri Gyananand ji replied - 'Shri Vishnu is himself Param Brahm Parmatma (Supreme God). Who can be above him? Shri Krishna was also Shri Vishnu himself. He only delivered the knowledge of Shrimad Bhagavad Gita. Who has misguided you?'

Dharmdas asked - 'In Gita Chapter 8 Verse 1, Arjun asked that "What is Tat Brahm?" In Gita Chapter 8 Verse 3, God has stated - He is "Param Akshar Brahm". He is someone other than God Krishna.'

Swami Gyananand said, "It seems that you have the spell of that weaver of Kashi on you. Go and do your work. There is no God other than God Krishna."

Dharmdas realised that Gyananand ji doesn't have that knowledge which Jinda Baba has explained with evidence. Disappointed, Dharmdas departed from there. Dharmdas did not know that the weaver of Kashi is that Baba Jinda only.

Dharamdas went to meet Mohangiri

Then Dharmdas learnt that there is a Mahamandleshwar called Mohangiri. He went to him and started discussing about God. First, Dharmdas donated one rupee to him, due to which Mohangiri made him sit near him, and told that - 'God Shiv is the creator of the entire nature. There is no God superior to him. Chant "Om NamH Shivay" mantra.'

Dharmdas bowed to him and left. He thought that he is so renowned, but he doesn't have knowledge even worth a paisa.

Dharamdas met a Naath Mahatma

Someone told Dharmdas that there is a very renowned ascetic. He has been doing religious austerity by standing for many years. Dharmdas went there. That ascetic was associated with Naath sect. He used to describe God Shiv as the Almighty God. He believed God could be attained through Hathyog by doing religious austerity. Dharmdas pondered that if God would be attained by such intense religious austerity, then it is out of our hands. He moved ahead from there too.

Dharamdas met a Kashi university scholar

He came to know that a very eminent scholar who has studied from Kashi University has come. He is well-versed with Vedas.

Dharmdas asked that Mahatama, "What is God like?" He got the answer - "He is formless."

"Does that formless God have any name?", Dharmdas asked. Answer of the scholar - "His name is Brahm."

"Can God be seen?", Dharmdas questioned. He got the answer - "God is formless. How can He be seen? Only God's light can be seen."

Question - 'Are Shri Krishna or Vishnu God?' Answer was - 'These are gods (sargun) in form and have merits; God is (nirgun) formless but has merits.

"What is the difference between the knowledge of Gita and Vedas?", Dharmdas questioned. Brahmin's answer was that - 'Gita is the summary of all the four Vedas.'

Dharmdas asked, "What is the mantra of bhakti?" Brahmin's answer was - "Chant Gayatri mantra - Om BhoorbhavswaH Tat SavituH Vareniyam Bhrigodevasya Dheemahi, Dheeyo Yo NaH Prachodyaat."

Jinda Baba had told Dharmdas that salvation is not possible with this mantra.

Dharamdas met a saint who lived in a cave

Dharmdas again moved ahead and found out that there is a saint who lives in a cave. He does not come out of the cave for many days. Dharmdas went to him and questioned, "How can God be attained?" He got the answer - "Have control over your senses; God is attained by this itself. There is no use of chanting mantra. Just by saying sugar, one doesn't get sweetness in the mouth."

Dharamdas Repented on his Ignorance & yearned for Jinda Mahatma

Dharmdas was not satisfied. After having discussion with all the saints, Dharmdas repented a lot that - 'I did not believe that Jinda Baba. He had told me that no saint Mahamandleshwar has the true spiritual knowledge. None of the Saint-Mahatmas have evidence-based knowledge. Their knowledge is not based on any scripture. Then, Dharmdas started crying. He started repenting on his ignorance that - "How unfortunate I am. I did not believe that God-like Jinda Mahatma. Now that omnipresent will not meet me because I have insulted him many times. What do I do now? I do not feel like living, and committing suicide is a sin." He started crying badly. He fell unconscious.

God in Jinda Mahatma-form sat down under a tree. Dharmdas gained consciousness and prayed from his heart that - 'O Jinda! Please appear before me once. I am shattered. No one has any knowledge. All your statements are true. God, please forgive the most ignorant and foolish me once. You are not Jinda; You are God. You are the most learned. Nobody can stand before your knowledge. I will never distrust you in my life.'

Thinking this, he moved forward and saw that a sage is sitting under a tree. Some people are sitting next to him. Dharmdas thought that I have met those Mahamandleshwars who have hundreds of devotees sitting next to them to obtain their sight. What is the point in meeting this ordinary sage? But then it occurred to him that - 'I have to rest for some time; let me do it here.' Then he thought that - 'Let me ask a question.' He asked, "O Mahatma! What is God like?" The sage replied, "I only am God." Dharmdas became silent. He thought that - "He is joking. He is not even a saint."

Gradually, everyone left. When Dharmdas was about to leave, God said, "O Mahatma! Did your Mahamandleshwars not tell you what God is like?" Dharmdas looked in surprise that how does this sage know where I have wandered? Immediately, God acquired that same form of Jinda Baba. Dharmdas fell at His feet and cried profusely, and said, "O God! Nobody has any knowledge. Maharaj! Forgive me the sinner who is full of demerits. I have committed a grave mistake. The knowledge of all the saints is like lighting a candle to the sun before the knowledge of the "Creation of Nature" that you have given. All talk nonsense."

Supreme God said to Dharmdas - "The well-versed scholars of the Vedas whom you had questioned that "What is God like?" You got the answer that God is formless. You had asked the question that "Can God be seen?" That ignorant's answer was that "When God is formless, then the question of seeing him does not arise. God's light can be seen."

• Just think, Dharmdas! These thoughts are like that of a blind person whom someone asks - "What is sun like?" One gets the answer - "Sun is formless." Then a question is asked that - "Can sun be seen?" One gets the answer - "Sun cannot be seen. Sun's light can be seen." Someone may ask that blind person that without the sun, how can its light be seen? Likewise, those blind people who are devoid of the eyes of spiritual knowledge, that is, completely ignorant saints give such description that - "God is formless; His light can be seen." How can His light be seen? The light would be coming from God only!

Dharmdas said that - 'O Mahatma! Even I did not think of this. My eyes have opened with your divine logic. All the Mahamandleshwars I have met were highly ignorant. O Jinda Mahatma! If I had not met these fools after listening to your knowledge, then my misconception would have never been dispelled, no matter how many evidence you would have shown or told.

Question 42 (Dharmdas): - O Jinda! Please do not mind. I have a doubt in my mind that - 'Is the worship of God Vishnu not good?'

Answer (of Jinda Mahatma): - O Dharmdas! There is proof in Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 2 Verse 46 that the speaker of Gita said - "O Arjun! After obtaining a very large reservoir of water (lake), whatever interest a person has got left in a small reservoir; the same amount of faith is left in other knowledge and the lower gods, after knowing the complete spiritual knowledge and the way of worship of the Complete God and the benefits obtained from Him. The same as is left in a small reservoir after obtaining a large water body. The water of the small reservoir is good, but not sufficient. If it does not rain for a year, the water of the small reservoir dries up, and the people dependent on it bear hardships due to shortage of water. There is a cry for help. But the water of the bigger reservoir (lake) does not finish even if does not rain for 10 years. A person, who will find such large reservoir, will immediately abandon the small reservoir (pond) and dwell near the bigger reservoir.

When the knowledge of Gita was narrated, at that time all the people were dependent on the water of ponds. Therefore, this example was given. Similarly, although you consider the worship of Shri Vishnu to be good, it does not lead to complete salvation. Shri Vishnu is also mortal. He also has birth and death. Then how can his worshipper be immortal? Therefore, to attain complete salvation, that is, to become immortal, one would have to worship the Immortal God only.

Question 43 (of Dharmdas): - O Jinda Mahatma! I distrusted you. I am a big sinner. Forgive me.

Answer (of Jinda Baba): - O Dharmdas! I myself had raised this thought in your mind. If you had not inspected those religious gurus of yours, you would have never trusted my statements. This thought would have bothered you from time to time that - 'It is not possible that none of the great sages, Mandleshwars, saints and Mahants of Hindu religion have (Tatvgyan) complete spiritual knowledge.' Now you will believe my statements.

Think, Dharmdas! The speaker of Gita says in Gita Chapter 4 Verses 32 and 34 that - 'The knowledge, which Param Akshar Brahm (Supreme God) narrates from His mouth, is Tatvgyan (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 32). Understand that knowledge by going to Tatvdarshi saints (Gita Chapter 4 Verse 34).'

In Gita Chapter 2 Verse 53, it is stated that - 'O Arjun! Deviating from the statements that mislead in different ways, when your intellect will become steadfast on one Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge), then you will attain yog (bhakti).' Meaning is that, then you will become a (bhakt) devotee.

Therefore, Dharmdas, I had inspired you to go to those saints-mahamandleshwars. Now you will attain yog (bhakti); you will be able to become a devotee.

Question 44 (of Dharmdas): - Will I have to abandon the worship of God Vishnu and God Shankar to attain complete salvation?

Answer (of Jinda Baba): - You do not have to leave these gods; you will have to leave their worship. 

Question 45 (of Dharmdas): - O Jinda! I did not understand. I do not have to abandon these gods Vishnu and Shankar and I will have to abandon their worship? I have a low intellect. I am highly ignorant person. Please explain in detail and oblige.

Answer (of Jinda Mahatma): - 'O Dharmdas! You are worshipping them arbitrarily by abandoning the scripture-based way of worship. Due to which you are not getting any benefit. The mantras of worship to obtain benefits from these gods are with me. Like, if there is a bull; you may keep calling him - 'Bull-Bull'; he won't look at you. There is a special mantra of him - 'Hurr-Hurr'. Listening to it, he immediately becomes attracted and goes towards the person calling him. Similarly, all these respectable gods have their personal mantras by which they give immediate and complete benefit.'

Dear readers! The same mantras are with me (Saint Rampal Das) which Supreme God has granted me through my Guru ji. Come and obtain them.

Like, I had told you (in the decription of the answer to Question no. 36) that consider this world to be a tree. Consider Param Akshar Purush to be its root, Akshar Purush to be its trunk, Kshar Purush to be a big branch and consider the three gods (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv) to be the branches of this world-like tree and the leaves to be the world. If you have brought a mango plant from somewhere, you will have to dig a pit and plant its roots into the soil and irrigate the roots. Then it will grow into a mango tree and bear fruits on its branches. Therefore, the branches of the tree cannot be severed, but they cannot be irrigated by planting them in the soil instead of the roots. Similarly, the scripture-based worship is done by establishing the root of the world-like tree, that is, Param Akshar Brahm as the deity and worshipping Him. This scripture-based worship leads to utmost benefit. The fruits of the religious acts done in this way are given by these three gods (branches of the world-like tree) only according to one's deeds. Therefore, their worship has to be abandoned, but they cannot be abandoned. This same evidence is also in Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 3 Verse 8 to 15. It is stated that -

• 'O Arjun! You may perform scripture-based action, that is, perform the act of (bhakti) worship that has been ordained in the scriptures. If you will abandon home and go to jungle, that is, if you will become a 'Karm Sanyasi' or if you will start worshipping by obstinately sitting in one place, then you will not be able to subsist yourself. Therefore, performing the act of worship while doing ones actions is superior to not doing any actions.' (Gita Chapter 3 Verse 8)
• Those worshippers, who relinquishing the way of worship mentioned in the scriptures, act arbitrarily, that is, the people who are engaged in acts other than the scripture-based acts of bhakti (worship), getting bound in the bondage of actions, always remain in the cycle of birth and death. Therefore, O son of Kunti, Arjun! Getting detached from the scripture-opposed acts of bhakti that you are doing, perform scripture-based acts of bhakti (worship). (Gita Chapter 3 Verse 9)
• After creating the world, the Prajapati (Master of the lineage), first of all creating the human beings, simultaneously giving the information about the yagyas, that is, religious rituals, had said to them that - 'You may prosper from doing the scripture-based actions in the way described. In this way, the bhakti (worship) done according to the scriptures shall give you the desired pleasures.' (Gita Chapter 3 Verse 10)
• In this way, from scripture-based worship, that is, by irrigating the root of the world-like tree, that is, by worshipping the Param Akshar Brahm (root), prosper the gods, that is, the three gunas-like branches (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv) of the world-like tree. Those gods (the three branches of the world-like tree, the three gods) may prosper you by giving fruits according to your deeds. In this way, by prospering each other, you will attain utmost wellbeing, that is, complete salvation. (Gita Chapter 3 Verse 11)
• The gods prospered by the yagyas, that is, by the scripturebased acts of bhakti, meaning the branches (three gods) flourished by the acts of bhakti performed by establishing the root of the world-like tree, that is, the Original Master (Param Akshar Brahm) as the deity, will definitely keep giving you the desired pleasures according to your deeds without you even asking for them. Like, by irrigating the root of the mango plant, it grows into a tree and the branches flourish. Then those branches will automatically bear fruits. The fruits will automatically fall on the ground on ripening. The wealth which a person acquires based on one's deeds is obtained by the abovementioned process. If a person does not do charity from the wealth given by those gods (branches), that is, if one does not again perform scripture-based religious acts, and only fills his/her stomach and only himself/herself uses it, he/she is a thief of God. (Gita Capter 3 Verse 12)
• In the scripture-based way of worship, first of all, food is offered to God. A Bhandara (common meal) has to be served. First, the Param Akshar Brahm is worshipped as the deity, then food is offered to Him, and then the remaining food is distributed among the devotees. Virtuous souls present in the (satsang) spiritual congregation eat that remaining food because only virtuous souls take time out for God to participate in religious rituals. Therefore, it is said that the saints who eat the remaining food from that yagya become free from all sins. The sinful people, who do not go in the satsang (spiritual congregation) of Tatvdarshi saint, do not gain knowledge. Those sinful souls only cook food to nourish their body. They only eat sin because before having food, we all devotees and saints offer food to Param Akshar Brahm. As a result of which, the entire food becomes blessed food. Those who do not do this, they are thieves of God. The food that is not offered to God is sinful food. Therefore, it is said that those who do not perform religious actions according to the scriptures, they incur sin. (Gita Chapter 3 Verse 13)
• All the living beings arise from food grain. Food grain arises from rain. Rain arises from Yagya, that is, from scripture-based religious rituals. Yagya, that is, religious rituals arise from scripture-based actions. (Gita Chapter 3 Verse 14)

Actions have arisen from Brahm i.e. Kshar Purush, because when all the living beings used to live in the eternal supreme abode, all the comforts and items there were available without doing any action. All the living beings of this place came with Kshar Purush due to their blunder. Now everybody only receives the fruit of their actions. Sustenance is only possible by performing actions. Therefore, it is said that consider actions to be arising from Brahm (Kshar Purush), and consider Brahm to have arisen from the Immortal God. (For more information, read "Creation of Nature") (Note: In this verse, the meaning of word "Akshar" as Immortal God is correct. But where there is description of Kshar Purush, Akshar Purush and Param Akshar Purush, there both Akshar Purush and Kshar Purush have been said to be mortal. There, that meaning of Akshar is correct. This description is given in Gita Chapter 15 Verses 16-17. Here, the meaning of 'Akshar' is Immortal God because it is clear from the creation of nature that Satya Purush [Immortal God] had given rise to Brahm.) This proves that 'Sarvgatam Brahm', that is, the God whose control is over all the Brahmands (universes), who is the Master of all, that God is always situated in the yagyas i.e. in religious rituals.

The purport is that by establishing the Param Akshar Brahm as the revered deity, and then doing (yagya) religious rituals, that is, by doing scripturebased actions, a worshipper gets the benefit of bhakti, which leads to salvation. Please see the picture of the world-like tree in this very book on page no. 166. See this picture on page 86, in this the branches of the tree have been shown to be planted in the ground. One who worships any of the three gods (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu, Tamgun Shiv), abandoning the injunctions of scriptures, is behaving arbitrarily which has been described as inappropriate and useless in Gita Chapter 16 Verses 23-24. He/she did not worship Sarvgatam Brahm i.e. Param Akshar Brahm, as a deity, due to which that worshipper's religious practice is useless. By irrigating the branches, a plant gets destroyed. The worship of other gods is forbidden in Gita Chapter 7 Verses 12 to 15, 20 to 23 and Gita Chapter 9 Verses 23-24. (Please read answer of Question 17) In this very book on Page 87, see the picture of the upright planted plant which is scripture-based way of worship. This only leads to salvation. This very evidence is given in Holy Book Gita. Therefore, O Dharmdas! You do not have to leave Shri Brahma, Shri Vishnu and Shri Shiv. You have to stop doing their worship as a deity. Only then complete salvation of a devotee is possible.

Question 46: - (of Dharmdas): O Jinda! You have clearly proven the state of those who worship the three gods (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv) in Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 7 Verse 12 to 15, 20 to 23 and Chapter 9 Verse 23-24 that - 'Those who worship the three gunas (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv), who have demoniac nature, are lowest among men, evil-doers, fools, do not worship me (speaker of Gita, Brahm). Those who worship the other gods have short-term (time in heaven) happiness. After going to heaven, they soon take birth on earth.' O Mahatma! Please narrate such an incident from this world which proves the veracity of your statements that the worshippers of the three gods behave like this.

"Story of Hirnyakashipu"

Answer (of Jinda Lord of the world) : -

1. The character of the worshippers of Rajgun Brahma: - There was a Brahmin King Hirnyakashipu. For some reason, he became jealous of God Vishnu (Satgun). That King pleased God Rajgun Brahma by doing his worship. Brahma said, "Worshipper! Ask what do you want?" Hirnakashyap asked that - "Neither shall I die in the morning, nor in the evening, neither in the afternoon nor at night, neither outside nor inside, nor in the twelve months, neither in the sky nor on earth, neither from a human being nor from an animal or bird." Brahma ji said, "So be it." After that, Hrinakashyapu believed himself to be immortal, and started asking everyone to chant his name. Whoever used to chant Vishnu's name, he used to kill him. His son Prahlad used to worship Vishnu. He tortured him a lot. O Dharmdas! You must be familiar with this story. The purport is that the devotee of Rajgun Brahma became known as a demon. He died a dog's death. 

"Story of Ravan and Bhasmasur"

2. The character of the worshippers of Tamgun Shiv: - The king of Lanka, Ravan, had worshipped Tamgun Shiv. He had captured 33 crore (330 million) demi-gods with his power. Then he abducted goddess Sita. What was his fate? You all know. Worshipper of Tamgun Shiv became known as Demon Ravan. He got completely ruined and became a recipient of criticism.

• Other evidence:- You must be aware of the story of Bhasmasur. Bhasmagiri used to worship God Shiv (Tamogun). For twelve years, he kept doing (tap) religious austerity by (Sheershasan) standing upsidedown with feet above and hands down in front of the door of Shiv. One day, Parvati said, "O Mahadev! You are almighty. What does your devotee want? Give it to him, Lord." God Shiv asked Bhasmagiri, "Tell devotee, what do you want? I am very pleased with you." Bhasmagiri said, "First promise me, then I will ask." God Shiv promised him. Then Bhasmagiri said, "Give me the Bhasmakanda (bracelet) that you have." God Shiv gave that Bhasmkanda to Bhasmagiri. As soon as Bhasmagiri got the bracelet in his hand, he said, "Beware Shiv! I will turn you into ashes and make Parvati my wife." Saying this, he laughed in an indecent manner and ran after Shiv to kill him. God Shiv knowing that evil person's motive ran away. The deity Shiv (Tamgun) was running ahead and the worshipper was following him.

When God Shiv was running ahead and Bhasmagiri behind him, at that time God Shiv prayed to Supreme God for help. Instantly, 'Param Akshar Brahm' assuming the form of Parvati appeared before vicious Bhasmasur, and said, "O Bhasmasur! Come and sit next to me." Bhasmagiri knew that now Shiv would not stop at a nearby place. Bhasmagiri was doing all this hooliganism for Parvati only. O Dharamdas! You know the entire story. God in Parvati form made Bhasmagiri do Gandhat dance and turned him into ashes. Worshipper of Tamoguni Shiv, Bhasmagiri, due to his wicked act became known as Bhasmasur i.e. Demon Bhasma. Therefore, the worshippers of these three gods are said to be of demoniac nature, lowest among men, evil-doers and fools.

"Massacre of Sadhus in Haridwar"

3. Now I will narrate the story of the worshippers of Satgun Shri Vishnu.

Once, Kumbh festival was held at the steps of Har in Haridwar. At that time, the worshippers of all the three gunas gathered in their respective groups. Giri, Puri, Naga-Naath - these are worshippers of Tamogun God Shiv, and Vaishnav are worshippers of Satgun God Vishnu. A row broke out between two groups "Naga and Vaishnav" over taking bath first on the steps of Har. Around 25 thousand worshippers of the three gunas (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv) got killed fighting with each other and caused carnage. They killed each other with swords, knives and daggers.

It is said in Sukshm Ved that: -

Teer tupak talwar kataari, jamdhar jor badhaavaen hain |
Har paudi har het nahin jana, vahan ja teg chalaavaen hain ||
Kaataen sheesh nahin dil karuna, jag mein saadh kahavaen hain |
Jo jan inke darshan kun jaavaen, unko bhi narak pathavaen hain ||

O Dharamdas! It has been proven from the aforesaid true stories that the worshippers of Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv have been said to be of demoniac nature, lowest among men, evildoers and fools in Gita Chapter 7 Verse 12 to 15.

Listening to the aforesaid story from the lotus-mouth of Supreme God Jinda, Dharmdas's head was about to explode. He started feeling giddy. Gathering courage, Dharmdas said, "O Lord! You have given eyesight to me who was blinded with ignorance. We used to hear and read all the abovementioned stories, but we never thought that we are treading on the wrong path. Hundreds of thanks to you. You have taken this sinner out of the hell, Lord!"

Question 47 (of Dharmdas): - O Jinda Mahatma! You told and I also saw with my own eyes in Gita Chapter 7 Verse 18 in which the speaker of Gita, Brahm, has described the salvation attained from his worship as Anuttam, that is, inferior/bad. Please explain this also like that. Narrate some story or account.

Answer (of Supreme God guised as Jinda Baba): -

• In Gita Chapter 2 Verse 12, Gita Chapter 4 Verse 5 and 9, and Gita Chapter 10 Verse 2, the speaker of Gita (Brahm) has stated that - 'O Arjun! You and I have had several births. You do not know; I know.'
• In Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 15 Verse 4, it is stated that - 'After gaining Tatvgyan (complete spiritual knowledge) from a Tatvdarshi Saint, one should search for that supreme state of the Supreme God, having gone where worshippers do not return to the world. The Supreme God from whom the world-like tree has extended, that is, the Supreme God from whom the entire world has arisen, you may worship that Supreme God only.'
• Then in Gita Chapter 18 Verse 62, the speaker of Gita said that - 'O Arjun! Go in the refuge of that Supreme God in every respect. Only by the grace of that Supreme God, you will attain supreme peace and the eternal supreme abode.'

The mantra of Brahm-worship is "Om". By this, Bram Lok is attained. In Gita Chapter 8 Verse 16, it is clear that those worshippers who have gone to Brahmlok also return to the world. Therefore, they cannot achieve supreme peace and cannot attain the eternal supreme abode.

God cannot be attained by the way of worship mentioned in the Vedas. Some (siddhis) spiritual powers are acquired, by which the sages perform miracles and become famous by causing harm to someone. In the end, by incurring sins, they suffer in the lives of eighty four lakh species of living beings. Therefore, the salvation achieved from the worship of Brahm is said to be (Anuttam) inferior/bad.

"Story of Sage Chunak and Mandhata"

Story: The speaker of Gita (Brahm) has mentioned in Gita Chapter 7 Verses 16-17 that four types of devotees worship me -

1. Aarth (for removal of miseries),
2. Artharti (for gaining wealth),
3. Jigyasu (who gather knowledge and become orators)
4. Gyani (who does bhakti only to attain salvation).

Abandoning three out of these, the speaker of Gita has described the fourth Gyani as his firm devotee.

Speciality of Gyani: - A Gyani is one who has realised that a human life is only attained for getting salvation. He/she also knows that for complete salvation, one should only worship One God. Complete salvation is not achieved by the worship of other gods (Rajgun Brahma, Satgun Vishnu and Tamgun Shiv). Because of not finding the Tatvdarshi saint mentioned in Gita Chapter 4 Verse 34 and Yajurved Chapter 40 Mantra 10, those Gyani (learned souls) themselves concluded from the Vedas that "Brahm" is the almighty God; 'Om' is the mantra of his worship. One goes to Brahmlok by doing this worship. This itself is salvation. Gyani (learned) souls practised (hathyog) intense meditation for attaining God. Sitting in one place, they performed intense meditation and chanted 'Om' mantra. Whereas, those who practice Hath, intense meditation, have been described as foolish, ostentatious and demons in Vedas and Gita. (Gita Chapter 3 Verses 4 to 9, Gita Chapter 16 Verses 17 to 20 and Gita Chapter 17 Verses 1 to 6.)

From where did they get the inspiration to do Hathyog? In Shri Devipuran (published from Gita Press Gorakhpur, Illustrated, Bold Font), Third Skand, it is written that Brahma told his son Narad that - "When I was born, I was sitting on a lotus flower. An ether voice occurred that - 'Do meditation, do meditation.' I meditated for 1000 years."

O Dharmdas! Brahma had found the Vedas later on during the churning of the ocean. When he read them, he found mantra "Om" in Yajurved Chapter 40 Mantra 15. Brahma himself started chanting it along with the hathyog (intense meditation) heard from the ether voice, and told it to his children (sages). (Those who by practising Hath perform intense meditation have been called demons, cruel and vile in the four Vedas and their summary Shrimad Bhagavad Gita. The evidence is given in Gita Chapter 16 Verses 17 to 20 and Chapter 17 Verses 1 to 6.) The learned sages also started performing the same religious practice. Out of those learned souls, I will narrate the story of a Sage Chunak by which you will get an accurate answer to your question.

There was a sage named Chunak. He performed intense meditation for thousands of years and chanted 'Om' mantra. This is worship of Brahm. Brahm has pledged that - "I cannot be seen by any religious practice, be it (Jap) chanting mantra, (Tap) meditation, or the (Yagyas) religious rituals mentioned in the Vedas, that is, I will not appear before anyone."

• In Gita Chapter 11 Verse 48, he has stated that - 'O Arjun! My form that you have seen, that is, the Kaal form that you saw, this is my own form. Neither can it be seen by the way of worship mentioned in the Vedas, nor by (jap) chanting any mantra, nor by performing (tap) meditation, nor by (yagyas) religious rituals, nor by any other ritual.'
• The speaker of Gita has clarified in Gita Chapter 7 Verses 24-25 that - 'This is my perpetual rule that I never appear before anyone; I remain hidden by my Yogmaya. These foolish people are considering me to be in human form, that is, in Krishna form.' The speaker of the knowledge of Gita was saying this pointing at the army standing in front. The purport of the statement was that - 'I never appear before anyone. Now I have shown you my form by showing favour to you.'

Meaning: - Brahm cannot be attained by the method mentioned in the Vedas and the other prevalent practices. Therefore, that Sage Chunak did not attain God, but attained siddhis (spiritual power). The sages considered it to be the final accomplishment of bhakti. One who used to have more siddhis was considered greater than the other sages. Sage Chunak had achieved the same.

There was a Mandhata Chakrvarti King (who had rule over the entire earth, such a powerful king). He had 72 crore (720 million) army. The king said to the kings under him that whoever does not accept subjection to me can fight with me. A placard was tied around the neck of a horse saying that - 'Whichever king does not accept the subjection to King Mandhata may capture this horse and get ready for a battle.' No king on earth held the horse. There were also some soldiers with the horse. On the way back, Sage Chunak asked, "Where had you gone, soldiers?" They replied, "We have roamed the whole earth, nobody captured the horse. Nobody accepted a battle with the king." The sage said, "I have accepted this battle." The soldiers said, "O pauper! You do not even have grains to eat and you will fight with King Mandhata?" Sage Chunak captured the horse and tied it to a tree.

When Mandhata King learnt about it, preparations of a battle were done. The King formed four squads of 72 crore army. He sent a squad of 18 crore army to attack the Sage. On the other hand, the sage formed four missiles by his siddhi (spiritual power). He released one missle which destroyed the 18 crore army of the King. The King sent the second squad. The sage released the second missile which destroyed the second squad of 18 crore army. In this way, Sage Chunak destroyed the 72 crore army of Mandhata King with four missiles. As a result of which, Great Sage Chunak became famous on the entire earth. He became known as the greatest sage due to this disaster.

O Dharmdas! (God in Jinda form said) The army that Sage Chunak killed, the sins of that got deposited in the (Sanchit Karm) accumulated deeds of the Sage. The one word 'Om' which Sage Chunak chanted, in return for that he would go to Brahmlok. Then after spending a luxurious time in Brahmlok, he would take birth on earth. As a result of the Hathyog, intense meditation that he practised, he would become a king on earth. Then after death, he would take birth as a dog. The 72 crore army that he killed would avenge itself. The dog would have wound on its head and the 72 crore army infesting it as worms will take its revenge. That is why, O Dharmdas! The speaker of Gita (Brahm) has called the state/salvation obtained from his worship as Anuttam (bad).

Question 45 (of Dharmdas): - O Jinda! I had asked a Mahamandleshwar a question that in Gita Chapter 18 Verse 62, in which Supreme God's refuge God Krishna is advising to go to. That Mahamandleshwar had replied that there is no God other than God Shri Krishna. Shri Krishna is himself Complete God; he is advising to come in his refuge only. It is only a different way of saying it. O Jinda! Please dispel this doubt of the ignorant me.

Answer (of Supreme God Baba Jinda) : - O Dharmdas!

Ye maala daal huye hain mukta | shatdal uva-baai bakta ||

All your Mandleshwars and Shankaracharyas by speaking nonsense are misleading the innocent public. They are saying that the Speaker of Gita in Gita Chapter 18 Verse 62 is asking Arjun to come in his refuge; this is completely wrong, because in Gita Chapter 2 Verse 7, Arjun has stated that - 'O Krishna! My mind is not working properly now. I am your disciple; I am in your refuge. Instruct me what is in my best interest.'

O Dharmdas! Arjun was already in the refuge of Shri Krishna. Therefore, in Gita Chapter 18 Verse 62, the Speaker of Gita has advised to go in the refuge of 'Param Akshar Brahm' who is other than him.

In Gita Chapter 4 Verse 3, the Speaker of Gita has said that - 'O Arjun, You are my devotee. That is why, I have narrated this Gita Scripture.' The evidence of the Complete God other than the Speaker of Gita is also in Gita Chapter 13 Verses 11 to 28, 30, 31 and 34.

• In Shrimad Bhagavad Gita Chapter 13 Verse 1, the Speaker of Gita has stated that - 'The body is called Kshetra; he who knows this Kshetra, that is, body is called 'Kshetragya'.' (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 1)
• In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 2, the Speaker of Gita has stated that - 'I am Kshetragya. Knowing both Kshetra and Kshetragya only is called Tatvagyan; this is my opinion.' In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 10, he has stated that - 'My worship should be unadulterous.' Like, the worship of other gods has been described as useless in Gita Chapter 7 Verses 12 to 15 and 20 to 23, and Chapter 9 Verses 23-24. Only worship Brahm. Regarding that, it is said here that do not be attracted towards other god. The purport is that understand knowledge for bhakti (worship) and mukti (salvation), not for becoming an orator. Apart from these, listening to knowledge to become an orator is useless. Do bhakti by keeping your devotion only in me like a chaste wife. One should not have the nature of sitting among other people and talking. Do bhakti in a solitary place.
• In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 11, the Speaker of Gita has mentioned that to look into Holy Books for Tatvgyan with interest in spiritual knowledge is Tatvgyan; this is knowledge, and instead of Tatvgyan, narrating and listening to stories, doing scripture-opposed worship, all this is ignorance. To know God for Tatvgyan is knowledge.

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 12, the Speaker of Gita has made aware about "Param Brahm" i.e. the Greater God than him. 'The God who is worthy of being known (Gyeyam), knowing whom (Amritam Ashnutey) one attains eternity, that is, one enjoys the nectar-like bliss of complete salvation; I will properly tell that. (Tat) that second (Brahm) God is neither said to be Sat nor Asat'; meaning that the Speaker of Gita has stated in Gita Chapter 4 Verses 32, 34 that - 'There is complete knowledge of God in Tatvgyan; God himself utters that Tatvgyan from his lotus-mouth.Tatvdarshi saints know that Tatvgyan. By prostrating before them and politely asking them questions, those Tatvdarshi saints who properly know the essence of God will impart Tatvgyan to you.' This proves that the Speaker of Gita does not have complete knowledge about God. Therefore, he is saying that, that other God, who is different from the Speaker of Gita, is neither 'Sat', nor 'Asat'. Here, the meaning of Par+Brahm is not the ParBrahm of seven sankh Brahmands, that is, the Akshar Purush of Gita Chapter 15 Verse 16 because in Kaal Lok (the region of 21 brahmands) Akshar Purush who is called ParBrahm does not have any specific role. Here in this Kaal Lok, there is role of Kaal and Dayal. Therefore, ('Par' means other and 'Brahm' means God) there is mention of God other than Brahm, Purna Brahm (Complete God), here.

Meaning: - In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 12, the Speaker of Gita is saying that - 'Brahm i.e. the God who is other than me is 'Anaadi' (beginningless).' The meaning of 'Anaadi' is one who never has any beginning, that is, who has never taken birth. The Speaker of Gita is Kshar Purush; he is also called "Brahm". In Gita Chapter 2 Verse 12, Gita Chapter 4 Verses 5, 9, and Gita Chapter 10 Verse 2, he has himself accepted that - 'O Arjun! You and I have had several births; you do not know. I know.' This proves that the Speaker of Gita is not the beginningless (Anaadi) 'Brahm' i.e. God. This proves that in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 12, the speaker of Gita has mentioned the glory of the Immortal God other than him. (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 12)

The Speaker of Gita is Brahm. He has one thousand hands and feet. He has Sahansra Kamal, that is, his lotus has thousand petals. In Gita Chapter 11 Verse 46, Arjun has said that - 'O Sahansrabahu (One with thousand arms)! You may appear in Chaturbhuj (four-armed) form.' This proves that the Speaker of Gita has only thousand arms. Therefore, in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 13, the Speaker of Gita is describing the glory of God other than him who has hands and feet in all directions, heads and faces in all directions and ears in all directions. He has stated that pervading everyone in the world, that is, securing everyone with his power, God is himself sitting in Satyalok (Shashvat Sthanm Tishthati). It has become clear that there is an Amighty God other than the speaker of Gita. He only manages and sustains the entire world. (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 13)

It is also clear in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 14 that the speaker of Gita is informing about a God other than him. He has stated - 'He is the knower of objects of all the senses, that is, He is Omniscient. He is devoid of all the senses, that is, the senses of God are not depraved like that of us human beings and other living beings. That God is free from attachment, that is, he does not have any attachment to anything in this Kaal Lok (twenty-one brahmands), because the Satyalok of that Supreme God is infinitely better than this place of Kaal. Therefore, that God is said to be free from attachment. He only nurtures and sustains everyone.' This evidence is also in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 17. 'That God is Nirgun (invisible with merits), but He shows his magnificence by being Sargun (visible with merits).'

For example - Like, a mango tree is in Nirgun state in the seed of mango. When that seed is sown, that plant then being Sargun in tree form shows its magnificence. But God is sitting in Sargun form in Satyalok because God has created the entire nature with his word-power, and making a law, he has let everything prevail. According to the law of that God, all the living beings and constellations keep forming and destroying. The living beings keep taking birth and dying based on their deeds. God has no tension. But when God appears on earth, at that time he experiences all the gunas. Like, a mango tree takes a long time to become Sargun (visible with merits) from Nirgun (invisible with merits), but there is no boundation of time for God. He can instantly become Nirgun and the next moment become Sargun. Like, in a fraction of a second, He goes to Satyalok so He becomes Nirgun for us. We cannot reap the benefits of His qualities. In a fraction of a second, He appears on earth, so He becomes Sargun. He gives benefits of His qualities by giving us blessings. Thus, He is said to be Sargun and Nirgun. This also proves that there is another God other than the speaker of Gita who nurtures and sustains everyone.

This evidence is also given in Gita Chapter 13 Verses 15-16. The Speaker of Gita has said that just as the sun despite being situated far away has its influence here on earth; similarly, God while being situated in Satyalok has the influence of His power on all the brahmands. He dwells outside and inside all the animate and inanimate things. Thus, because of being subtle, we are unable to see Him with naked eyes. Therefore, He is Avigya, that is, beyond our knowledge, and that same God is situated near us and also away from us. God is far away in Satyalok (Shashvat Sthaan); the effect of His power is with everyone. (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 15)

Like, the sun is situated far away, but every person on earth perceives it to be with him or her. For example, if many pots filled with water are placed in one place, then sun is visible in each one of them. It is not visible in parts. Similarly, God is visible to everyone. Just like this, God is situated in one place. That God is worth knowing. The purport is that the speaker of Gita has said that one should know about the God other than me; He is worth knowing. That same God according to his law, preserves, creates and kills everyone.

In reality, He only is Brahma (Creator-of-all). In reality, He only is Vishnu (Preserver-of-all). In reality, He only is Shankar (Destroyer-of-all). The other Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar are the masters of only one Brahmand. But that God is himself the Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar of all the Brahmands.

Like, in India, there is a home minister of the Centre and there are also home ministers of the states. The Prime Minister of the country sometimes also keeps another department with me. At that time, the Prime Minister is also a Home Minister etc. as well as the Prime Minister. This proves that the Speaker of Gita has described the glory of the Almighty God other than him. There is some Complete God other than the Speaker of Gita. (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 16.)

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 17, the Speaker of Gita has described the glory of God other than him, which is as follows: -

• That other God (Param Brahm) is the light of all lights, that is, He is the source of all lights. Everything is illuminated by the power of that other Almighty God only. And the brightness of that God is more than everything else. That God is said to be far away from Maya.

In reality, He only is Niranjan. The speaker of Gita is said to be "Jyoti Niranjan" along with Maya. That God is a treasure of knowledge. He is worth knowing. He is worthy of (Gyangamyam) being attained through knowledge. In the original text of this Gita Chapter 13 Verse 17, "Gyanm Gyeyam Gyan Gamyam" is written. Its meaning is that (Gyanm) the knowledge, Tatvgyan, which God himself utters from his lotus-mouth by appearing on earth. Therefore, his form is knowledge, that is, he is the treasure of knowledge. That God (Gyeyam Gyangamyam) is worthy of being known through that Tatvgyan as well as worthy of being attained by that Tatvgyan. That God is situated in the heart of all the living beings.'

Like, the sun despite being far away is visible in the water of each pot. Actually, it is not in those pots. But it has its influence on the pots, it gives its heat. 

It is stated in the Sukshm Ved that : -

Brahma Vishnu Shiv Rai Jhoomakra | Nahin sab baaji ke khamb suno Rai Jhoomkara ||
Veh sarv thaam sab thaur Rai Jhoomakra | Sakal lok bharpoor suno Rai Jhoomakra ||

This same evidence is also given in Gita Chapter 18 Verse 61. It is mentioned that - 'O Arjun! The Omniscient God by his Maya i.e. by his power revolves all the living beings, mounted on the body-like machine, according to their deeds, meaning that according to their fate makes them roam around in good and bad lives.

That Almighty God is situated in the heart of all the living beings.' In this way, the glory of the Supreme God has been described in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 17. This proves that the Speaker of Gita has described the glory of the Complete God other than him. (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 17)

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 18, the Speaker of Gita has stated that - 'Thus I have said in brief the knowledge about the Kshetra i.e. body, Gyanm i.e. Tatvgyan, and Gyeyam i.e. the God who is worth knowing. My devotee was previously dependent only on me considering me to be the Almighty. Based on this (Vigyaay) Tatvgyan, on becoming familiar with my characteristic i.e. my power and the power of that Almighty (Up Padyate) after that by doing bhakti attains that characteristic only.' (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 18)

Likewise, in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 19, the Speaker of Gita has mentioned the glory of the Purush i.e. the God other than him. He has stated that Prakriti and Purush both are beginningless (eternal). Here, Prakriti means Prakriti of Satyalok, who is called Parashakti, Paranandani, Mahan Prakriti. The meaning of Purush is Complete God. Both of these are beginningless (eternal). This Prakriti does not imply the Prakriti in woman-form like Durga in woman-form. For example, if there is Sun, then its Prakriti heat is also with it. Similarly, Satyapurush and his Prakriti, that is, Power, both are eternal. Thus, Prakriti from whom the vices and the three gunas have originated is different. Consider these to have originated from that Prakriti. In Gita Chapter 7 Verses 4-5, two Prakritis have been mentioned, one is inert and the other is conscious Goddess Durga. The second Prakriti mentioned here is Durga. (Gita Chapter 13 Vese 19)

Even in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 20, there is decription of another (PurushH) God. In the translation of this verse in the Gita published from Gita Press Gorakhpur, the meaning of "PurushH" has been written as 'Soul'. Actually, the meaning of Purush here is God. See the actual 95 translation of Gita Chapter 13 Verse 20 in "Gehri Nazar Gita Mein" which can be seen on and downloaded from our website.

Even in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 21, there is description of another (PurushH) God. In its translation in the Gita published from Gita Press Gorakhpur, the meaning of "PurushH" has been written as Purush only; this is correct. The meaning of PurushH is God. According to the context, the meaning of PurushH is also written as man because God has made man according to his own image. Therefore, it is said that :-

Nar Narayan roop hai, tu na samajh dehi |

"Human Body is Superior to the Bodies of Eighty-Four Lakh Types of Living Beings"

Even in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 22, the Speaker of Gita has clearly given evidence of God other than him. This verse has been completely misinterpreted in the Gita published from Gita Press Gorakhpur. (Please see book Gita Tera Gyan Amrit on Page 216 to 368)

Actual translation:- Like, there has been a description in the previous verses that God lives with every living being just as the sun appears to be situated in the water of each pot. It is giving its heat to the water. Likewise, God is situated in the heart of every living being. Just as a solar power plant, wherever it is installed, absorbs the heat from the sun and stores as energy; likewise, God lives with every living being. Therefore, it is stated in this verse (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 22) that - 'Because of being the Master of all gods, that God is "Maheshwar"; because of sustaining and nurturing everyone, He is the "Doer"; because of seeing every activity of all the living beings while sitting in Satyalok, He is the "Spectator".

A living being/soul performs all the tasks with the power of God. A soul is a part of God. (In Ramayan also, it is said - Ishwar Ansh Jeev Avinashi) Due to which, whatever joy or sorrow a living being/soul experiences due to the deeds done by him or her, God also feels that joy and sorrow of His part.'

It is written in Sukshm Ved -

"Kabir kah mere jeev ko dukh na deejo koye, Bhakt dukhaye main dukhi mera aapa bhi dukhi hoye |"

'Therefore, He is called the "Experiencer". God secretly gives appropriate advice to every living being; therefore, He is called the "Permitter".' (The division of the word Paramatma = Param + Atma = Supreme Soul.) If someone gives the experience of sorrow as well as of joy and whatever deed a living being performs, he or she definitely gets its result, then he is not called "Paramatma"; he is not Supreme Soul.

Like, it is a rule in this Kaal's (Brahm's) Lok that based on whatever deed you will perform, God will definitely give its result to you. Then, he is indeed the Master, but he is not the Supreme Soul. 'The (ParH) other (PurushH) God lives with the soul in this human body in an inseparable way.' Like, the sun gives its energy to everyone; similarly, this other God has the abovementioned glory. Like, the bulb that glows with the solar energy has the sun in it, meaning the power of sun works in it. Likewise, understand the role of the Complete God.

Even in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 23, another (Purushm) God has been mentioned. It has been stated that - 'A saint who knows about (Purushm) God and Prakriti along with the Gunas in the abovementioned way, that saint-worshipper (vartmaan) while remaining engrossed in God in every way is not reborn, that is, he attains complete salvation.'

Even in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 24, there is mention of another God who is other than the Speaker of Gita. It is stated that - 'The God who just like sun lives inseparably with the soul, worshippers see Him in the heart with divine vision through meditation; like the electricity is seen via a tester. Other worshippers, after listening to the knowledge and believing it, accept the image of God. Other devotees (karmyogen) on seeing the actions, that is, divine plays of God, come to know about the existence of God.

Like, the population of the world is approximately 7 arab (7 billion). Nobody's face matches with each other. (A poet has said - "Kayi arab banaaye bandey, aankh naak haath lagaaye ek-doosre ke naal koyi bhi, raldey nahin ralaaye") This also proves that there is some Omniscient power that is called "Parmatma" (God). Some devotees on seeing such acts of God believe in God.'

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 25, it has been stated that - 'Those who are not educated and who do not meditate, who are unable to understand knowledge and neither are able to understand God from His creation, they, on hearing the glory of God from other educated and learned people, accept that if this educated and learned person is saying, then God exists. Then they start doing worship. Because of listening to them, accepting the existence of God, they start doing worship; as a result of which they cross over the mortal world.'

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 26, only this much is said that - 'All the living beings are born by the union of Kshetra, that is, body of Durga and Kshetragya, that is, the speaker of Gita, Kshar Brahm.' Do remember, the speaker of Gita in this very Chapter 13 Verse 1 has said that body is called "Kshetra", and one who knows about the body is called "Kshetragya". In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 26, it is said that - 'Whichever living beings are born in this Kaal Lok (twenty-one Brahmands), they are born from the union of Durga and Kaal God, that is, Kaal's Creation is produced from male and female by the inspiration of Kaal.'

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 27, another God is clear who is other than (different from) the Speaker of Gita: - Like, it has been mentioned in the previous verses along with the evidence that the Supreme God is sitting in the heart of every living being just as the sun is visible in the pots filled with water. Similarly, in this Verse 27, it is stated that - 'The Supreme God is sitting in the heart. Even when the body of a living being is destroyed, the Supreme God is not destroyed.' Like, if a pot breaks and its water spills on the ground, the water gets absorbed in the ground; nonetheless, the sun is unchanged. Therefore, Supreme God is immortal. 'A saint, who perceives God with this viewpoint, knows Him correctly. He is a Tatvdarshi Saint.' In this Verse (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 27), 'Parmeshwar' word is written. It is also indicative of another God other than the Speaker of Gita.

Let us find out: - Division of word of "Parmeshwar" = Param + Ishwar Interpretation: - The meaning of "Ish" is Lord, God, Master. "Var" means supreme, husband.

1. 'Ish' is the Speaker of Gita "Kshar Purush, that is, Kshar Brahm who is the Ish, that is, the Lord of twenty-one brahmands.
2. Ishwar = Ish i.e. God greater than Kshar Purush. He is the Lord of only 7 Sankh (700 quadrillion) brahmands. He is also called Akshar Purush and ParBrahm.
3. Parmeshwar = He who is (Param) superior to Ishwar, that is, who is greater than Akshar Purush. He is the Lord of infinite brahmands. He is also called Param Akshar Brahm. (Its evidence is given in Gita Chapter 8 Verse 3)

In Gita Chapter 15 Verse 16-17, there is description of three Purushs (gods). Kshar Purush - he is Ish, the Speaker of the knowledge of Gita, and Akshar Purush - he is Ishwar. And in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 17, it is stated that - '(Uttam PurushH) Purushottam, that is, the most superior God is actually different from the two (Kshar Purush and Akshar Purush) mentioned in the above Verse (Gita Chapter 15 Verse 16). In reality, He only is called "Parmatma". He only by entering into the three loks [the area of twenty-one brahmands of Kshar Brahm is called Kaal Lok, and the area of the 7 sankh brahmands of Akshar Purush is called the Lok of ParBrahm, and the area of the upper four loks (Satyalok, Alakh Lok, Agam Lok, and Akah Lok), Amar Lok, is called the Lok of Parmeshwar/Supreme God. Thus, there is description of three Loks here] sustains everyone. He is actually the Immortal God.'

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 27, there is word "Parmeshwar", which is indicative of the Almighty, the Sustainer-of-all other than the Speaker of Gita.

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 28 also, there is evidence of a God other than the Speaker of Gita. In this Verse, the word "Ishwar" is indicative of Parmeshwar (Supreme God). Like, the meaning of 'Ish' is Lord; 'Var' means 'Supreme'. In reality, the 'Ish' or Lord of all is Param Akshar Brahm. He only is the Supreme Ish; therefore, the word "Ishwar" based on the context is indicative of the Complete/Supreme God. If the other 'Ish' (gods) had not been fake lords, there would have been no need for the words 'Ishwar' and 'Parmeshwar'. Therefore, in this verse, consider the word 'Ishwar' to be indicative of 'Satya Purush' (Supreme God).

The meaning of Gita Chapter 13 Verse 28, the speaker of Gita has stated that - {A worshipper who sees Supreme God equally in everything, (aatmanm) his soul (aatmna) does not destroy by his ignorant soul, that is, by correctly understanding God and worshipping Him (tatH) by it (paraam = paraa) other (gatim) salvation (yaati) attains.}

Translation: - A worshipper, who sees Supreme God equally in everything, does not destroy his soul by his ignorant soul, that is, by correctly understanding God and worshipping Him, he attains the other salvation by it, that is, that worshipper attains the salvation other than the supreme salvation of the Speaker of Gita (which has been mentioned in Gita Chapter 8 Verse 13).

It is clear in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 30 that the Speaker of Gita has described the glory of a God other than him. He has stated that - 'Consider a saint, who considers all the living beings despite having different states to be under one Almighty God, to have attained "Sachidanandghan Brahm", that is, Param Akshar Brahm. By doing true bhakti, he attains that Supreme God.'

Even in Gita Chapter 13 Verse 31, the Speaker of Gita has mentioned about "Parmatma" (God) other than him. In this Verse, there is word "Parmatma", whose clear definition has been given in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 17. It is stated that - 'He, who is Uttam Purush, that is, Supreme God, by entering into the three Loks sustains everyone. He is the Immortal God in reality. He only is called "Parmatma". He is other than Kshar Purush and Akshar Purush.' In this Verse (Gita Chapter 13 Verse 31) also, this only has been clarified that - 'That God, because of being beginningless and Nirgun, even while residing in the body of every living being (like a sun in a pot of water) neither does anything [because the power of God performs all the tasks. Like, the sun is visible in the water of the pot. The water is getting heated by it. The sun does not appear to do it; its heat is doing it. The sun does not seem to be doing anything] nor gets smeared in the body.' (Like, the sun does not get smeared in the water).

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 32 also, this very evidence is given.

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 33, the state of the soul and the body has been mentioned.

In Gita Chapter 13 Verse 34, the Speaker of Gita has given information about the Supreme God other than him. He has stated that - 'In this way, those worshippers who with the eyes of knowledge, that is, by Tatvgyan become conversant with the difference between Kshetra (body) and Kshetragya (Speaker of Gita), they, on finding a Tatvdarshi Saint, by doing true scripture-based worship while performing daily tasks, by understanding the Tatvgyan and gaining freedom from Kaal's Prakriti, that is, the web of Kaal, attain that Param, that is, other Param Brahm Parmatma (Supreme God).'

It has become clear from the abovementioned description that there is a Complete God other than the Speaker of Gita. By worshipping Him, a worshipper attains the complete salvation that has been mentioned in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 4 that - 'After gaining Tatvgyan, one should search for that supreme state of the Supreme God, having gone where, a worshipper never returns to this world. '

Summary

From the abovementioned pieces of evidence and the aforesaid proofs from Chapter 13, it has become clear that there is Param Akshar Brahm, that is, Complete God other than the Speaker of Gita. The speaker of Gita has advised to go in His refuge in Gita Chapter 18 Verses 62, 66. He only is the Giver of complete salvation; He only is worthy of being worshipped; He only is the Creator of all; He only is the Preserver of all, the Sustainer of all, the Giver of all happiness. He is called "Parmatma".

Question 49 (of Dharmdas): - In Gita Chapter 4 Verse 6, the Speaker of Gita has stated that despite being unborn and also being immortal and also being the Lord of all the living beings, I appear by my Yog Maya. In this, Shri Krishna is calling himself the immortal God of all the living beings. He has also called himself as unborn.

Answer (of Jinda Supreme God): - O Dharmdas! Kaal Brahm has delivered the knowledge of Gita by entering into the body of Shri Krishna. There is no role of Shri Krishna. The Speaker of the knowledge of Gita is Kaal Brahm.

The Speaker of Gita has stated that - 'All the living beings that are under me in my twenty-one brahmands, I am their Supreme God.' This evidence is also given in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 18 that the Speaker of Gita has said that - 'Based on the folklore (hearsay), I am famous as Purushottam (Supreme God) in my twentyone brahmands because I am superior to the embodied living beings and the immortal soul who are under me in my twenty-one brahmands. In reality, Purushottam (Supreme God) is someone else who is mentioned in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 17.'

In Gita Chapter 4 Verse 6, it is stated that - 'I (ajH) am unborn, that is, I am not born like you. I appear by my (leela) divine act.' Like, in Gita Chapter 10, he had shown the Viraat form. Then he has said that (Avyayatma) my soul is immortal. Then he has said that (Sambhavami) I take birth (Aatmmayya) by my divine act.

Here, taking birth is mentioned because this Kaal Brahm dies after one yug of Akshar Purush. Then at that time, one Brahmand is destroyed. (See the answer of Question 9). Then all the souls go to another brahmand. Even the soul of Kaal Brahm goes there. There he again acquires a young body. Similarly, Goddess Durga dies. Then she also acquires a young body along with Kaal. This is a rule of Param Akshar Brahm (Satya Purush). Then in that new brahmand, both of them in the form of husband-wife give rise to new Rajgun-equipped Brahma, Satgun-equipped Vishnu and Tamgun-equipped Shiv. Then the sequence of creation commences in that Brahmand. In this way, this Kaal Brahm dies and is born by divine act.

It is also clear in Gita Chapter 4 Verse 9, in which the Speaker of Gita has stated that - 'My births and actions are supernatural.' In reality, he is mortal. The soul of all the living beings is immortal.

Your Mahamandleshwars, Acharyas and Shankaracharyas do not have any knowledge. Therefore, because of not understanding the precious holy books properly, they narrate folklores (baseless stories). You may see in this Gita Chapter 4 Verse 5 that the Speaker of Gita is himself saying that - 'O Arjun! You and I have had several births. I know them all; you do not know.' Its meaning has been explained above. The meaning of Sambhavat is to take birth.

Evidence: - It is also mentioned in Yajurved Chapter 40 Mantra 10 that - 'Some consider God to (Sambhavaat) take birth like Ram and Krishna; some consider Him to (Asambhavaat) not take birth and be formless, that is, listen to the Tatvdarshi Saints who impart true knowledge. They will tell whether God is born or not.'

In reality, God is Self-existent. He has never taken birth, neither will. There is no question of death. On the other hand, the speaker of Gita is himself saying that - "I take birth and die. I am not immortal. 'Param Akshar Brahm' is immortal."

Question 50 (of Jinda Baba Supreme God): - You said that you do not even let a Shudra (one of lower caste) sit near you. You remain pure. What harm does it cause to bhakti?

Answer (of Dharmdas): - If a Shudra (person of lower caste) touches a devotee, he or she becomes impure. God becomes annoyed. You feel guilty. We are Vaishyas of a higher caste.

"Difference between Speech and Action"

Question 51 (of Dharmdas): - O Jinda! It is indeed true that a devotee remains pure by maintaining a distance from a Shudra. Do you not believe this?

Answer (of Baba Jinda): - Who gave you this teaching?

Dharmdas said - "Our religious gurus tell this. Acharyas, Shankaracharyas and Brahmins tell this."

Supreme God Kabir told Dharmdas (till then Dharmdas did not know that this person talking to him is himself weaver Kabir) that Weaver Kabir once went with Pandit Swami Ramanand ji to a Satsang-Bhandara (spiritual discourse followed by a communal meal) in a place called Totadrik. Weaver Kabir is a disciple of Swami Ramanand. The main Pandit Acharyas told in the Satsang (spiritual discourse) that Lord Ram ate berries already tasted by Shudra Bhilni. God was impartial. He is pleased by love. A devotee should not discriminate between higher and lower caste. One's devotion is seen. Lakshman considering Shabri to be Shudra didn't eat the berries in contempt; he threw them away. Later, those berries became life-giving herbs. In the battle with Ravan, Lakshman fell unconscious. Hanuman lifted the Dronagiri Mountain, on which the tasted berries had become life-giving herbs, and brought it over. Lakshman became conscious on eating that herb. His life was saved. Such was Shabri's devotion towards God. One should never hurt anyone's devotion. Immediately after the spiritual discourse, (langar) the communal meal began. The Pandits had already made a scheme that the Shudra Weaver Kabir has come with Brahmin Swami Ramanand ji. He is a disciple of Swami Ramanand. He will have food with Ramanand ji. We Brahmins would be insulted. Therefore, they started Langar at two places. Where there was provision of food for the Pandits, they kept a condition for having food there that whosoever will have food in the Pandits' Bhandara will have to recite four mantras of Vedas. He who would not be able to recite any mantra would have to eat in the common man's bhandara. They knew that Weaver Kabir of Kashi is uneducated; he is a Shudra. How can he know any Ved mantras? All the Pandits after reciting four Ved mantras were entering into the Bhandara of Pandits. There was a queue. Weaver (Dhanak) Kabir was also standing in that queue. Kabir ji's turn came to recite the Ved mantras. At a small distance, a buffalo was grazing. Kabir ji called the buffalo. He said - 'O Buffalo Pandit! Please come here.' The buffalo came running. He came and stood next to God Kabir. God Kabir put his hand on buffalo's back and said - 'O learned buffalo! Recite four mantras of Vedas.' The buffalo recited the

1. (1) Yajurved Chapter 5 Mantra 32 and also told its meaning that - 'He who is the giver of ultimate peace (Ushig Asi), who can destroy sins (Anghaari), who is the enemy of bondages i.e.Bandichhor = Bambhari, He "Kavirasi" is Kabir; Swarjyoti = Self-illuminated, that is, who has a bright body, "Ritdhama" = that of Satyalok, that is, He resides in Satyalok. "Samraatasi" = He is God of all gods, that is, He is Almighty.
2. (2) He narrated Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 86 Mantra 26. Its meaning is that - 'God departs from the upper loks and comes here; He meets noble souls. He removes all the crises of those who do bhakti. He is Kavirdev (Supreme God Kabir).'
3. (3) He narrated Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 96 Mantra 17. Its meaning is that - '("KaviH" = Kavir) God Kabir propagates Tatvgyan by himself appearing on earth. It is called Kavirvaani (Kabir Vaani/ Kabir speech). God Kabir narrates the true spiritual knowledge (Tatvgyan) by uttering Kabir Vaani in verses in the form of proverbs, couplets, hymns, quatrains and poems.'
4. (4) He also narrated Rigved Mandal 9 Sukt 94 Mantra 1. Its meaning is that - 'God while behaving like poets goes from one place to another on earth.'

The buffalo then says, 'Innocent Pandits! This, who is standing next to me in this queue with his hand on my back, is that same God Kabir, whom people call a 'poet'. By his grace only, today I am reciting Ved mantras like human beings.'

Supreme God Kabir said - 'Buffalo Pandit, you may enter the langar (mess) of the Pandits and have food there. I am a Shudra; I am uneducated. Therefore, I will go in the langar of common people to have food. At that very moment, all the Pandits who had gathered there hearing the buffalo reciting the Ved mantras fell at God Kabir's feet and asked for forgiveness for their mistake.

Supreme God Kabir said: -

Karni taj kathni kathaen, agyani din raat | Kukar jyon bhaunkat phiren, suni sunaayi baat ||

"In the Satsang, you were saying that God Ramchandra ate berries tasted by Shabri (Bhilni) of Shudra caste with great interest. He did not practice untouchability and you consider yourself to be even superior to God. You only speak, but do not act. Hearing things from one another, you keep barking like dogs." Along with all the Pandits present there, thousands of people became disciples of Weaver Kabir and took initiation. Quitting scripture-opposed way of worship, they started doing scripture-based way of worship and got their welfare done.

O Dharmdas! You are saying the same thing that you do not even allow a Shudra to sit near you. Dharmdas felt very ashamed. But considering the teaching of God to be a satire on him, he got irritated, and said that - "O Jinda! I do not like your acrimonious statements. You do not know how to talk. You say that - 'You all keep barking hearsay information like dogs'." Saying this, Dharmdas made a face. He expressed his displeasure. God in Jinda form disappeared. When he disappeared the fourth time, Dharmdas's life became miserable. He cried his eyes out. That day Dharmdas again had a conversation with God. (In this way, Supreme God Kabir disappeared altogether six times, and then Dharmdas came to his senses.)

Departing from Vrindavan Mathura, Dharmdas while crying set off for his village Bandhavgarh. Dharmdas ji had made a programme of travelling to places of pilgrimage for six months. Within 15 days, he headed back towards home.

Garibdas ji has stated in his nectar-speech:-

Tahan vahan rovat hai Dharmni nagar, kahan gaye mere sukh ke sagar |
Ati viyog hua ham seti, jaise nirdhan ki lut jaay kheti |
Ham to janey tum deh swaroopa, hamri buddhi andh gahar koopa |
Kalp karey aur man mein rovae, dashon disha kun vo magh johae |
Beg milo karahun apghata, main na jeevun suno Vidhata |

When Dharmdas reached Bandhavgarh, at that time he was weeping badly. Entering into the house, he fell on his face and started crying his heart out. His wife's name was Amini Devi. Seeing her husband crying and come back home before time, she thought that - 'It seems that someone has looted Bhagatji. Because of losing all the money, he has returned home.'

Sitting next to Dharmdas, wiping his tears with her hands, she said - 'Why are you losing heart? Nevermind; someone has looted your travel money. You don't have any shortage of money. Take some more. Finish your pilgrimage and then return. I won't forbid you.' After some time, pulling himself together,

Dharmdas said that - 'Amini Devi, if my money had been looted, I would have taken some more, but I have lost such a wealth which I might not get again. I have lost it myself due to my own foolishness.' He narrated the entire discussion of knowledge that took place with Jinda Mahatma and the 'Creation of Nature' heard from Jinda Baba to Amini Devi. On seeing the entire knowledge along with evidence, Amini said - 'Seth ji, you were an adept businessman. You never used to do a loss-making deal. Such an evidencebased knowledge, still you did not believe. It was obvious for the sadhu to get upset. Numerous times he met you and taught you like a child, why did you reject him?'

Dharmdas said - 'Amini! For the first time in my life, I have done a loss-making deal. I won't be able to recover this loss. If I do not get that wealth, I will not survive.'

"Taking Dharmdas ji to Satlok"

For six months, Supreme God Jinda did not come. Dharmdas got sick from crying too much; he ate very little. He used to cry for hours several times a day. His body emaciated. One day Amini Devi asked Dharmdas - 'O Swami! I cannot see this state of yours. Have faith; when he has come so many times earlier, then he will come this time too.'

Dharmdas said - 'He has never taken this long. It seems that he has become very angry with this sinner. It is definitely something to be angry about. I am a big fool, Amini Devi! Now I have realised his importance. He appears naive, but he is a recipient of special favour of God. I have never seen or heard so much knowledge.'

Amini asked - 'Did he tell how one can meet him, and where does he go?'

Dharmdas said - "He was saying that - 'I definitely go to places where (bhandara) religious communal meals are held. I impart knowledge to people there'."

Amini Devi said - 'Organise a Bhandara (communal meal). Perhaps, Jinda Baba may come.'

Dharmdas said - 'I will do bhandara for three days.' Amini Devi used to be a miser earlier. If Dharmdas used to say that he will do bhandara for three days, she used to get adamant on one day. But that day Amini immediately gave her approval - 'No problems; Do bhandara for three days.'

Dharmdas sent the message of three-day bhandara to far off places. He sent invitations to Sadhus. The bhandara commenced on the fixed date. Two days passed. Sadhu-Mahatmas came; discussion of knowledge kept taking place. But the knowledge that Jinda Baba had delivered, he did not find the answer to that with anyone. Dharmdas deliberately used to ask the Sadhus that - 'Do Brahma, Vishnu and Shiv also take birth?' He used to get the same trite reply that - 'They do not have mother-father.' It used to become clear from this to Dharmdas that, that Jinda Mahatma hasn't come. If he had even come in disguise, he would have given the correct knowledge. Even on the third day, Jinda Baba had not come by afternoon. Dharmdas making a firm decision said, "If the Jinda Baba does not come today, I will commit suicide. It is better to die than to lead such a life." God is omniscient. He knew that his devotee will definitely die today.

There was a Kadam Tree at a short distance. Immediately, He became visible sitting under that tree in that same Jinda attire to Dharmdas. Dharmdas ran towards him, saw carefully, and embraced Jinda Mahatma. He asked for forgiveness for his mistake. He repeatedly promised to not repeat such a mistake again. Then God went to Dharmdas's house. Amini and Dharmdas both served him a lot; both took initiation. God in Jinda form gave the first mantra to both of them. Supreme God stayed in their garden for a few days. Then one day, Dharmdas again committed a similar mistake. God suddenly disappeared.

Dharmdas repented a lot. He quit eating and drinking, and pledged that until you appear before me, I will not eat or drink anything. Dharmdas became very weak. He even struggled to sit and stand. On the sixth day, God came. He stood Dharmdas up with his own hands and embraced him. He fed him with his hands. Dharmdas first washed God's feet and took Charnamrit (foot-nectar). Then the discussion of knowledge started.

Dharmdas asked, "How did you gain so much knowledge?"

Supreme God said, "I met Satguru.He lives in Kashi City. His name is Kabir. He is himself Supreme God. He is doing a divine play by disguising as a Satguru. He works as a weaver. He showed me Satlok; that Lok is a class apart. The comforts there are not even in heaven. There are evergreen fructiferous trees, exquisite gardens, and rivers of milk flowing there. Beautiful males and females live there. They never grow old. No one ever dies. Listening to the Tatvgyan from Satguru, one who does bhakti after attaining Satnaam, he or she goes to that Supreme Abode. Its description is also in Gita Chapter 15 Verse 4."

Dharmdas insistingly said that - 'O Maharaj! Please show me that Eternal Place so that my faith deepens.'

Supreme God said - 'You do bhakti. When you will die, you will attain that Lok.' On repeated insistence of Dharmdas, Supreme God Jinda said - 'Come, let me take you to Satyalok.' Taking Dharmdas's soul out, He took him above to Satyalok.

A sentry was standing on the gate of the court of Supreme God. Supreme God standing in the form of Jinda Baba said to the sentry - 'Get Dharmdas the audience of Supreme God.'

The sentry said to another hans (a devotee is called hans in Satlok) that - 'Take Dharmdas to the throne of Supreme God. Get him the audience of SatyaPurush.'

Many hans (male devotees) and hansni (female devotees) dancing and singing together respectfully took Dharmdas with them. All the male and female devotees were wearing beautiful garlands in their necks. The brightness of their bodies was equivalent to sixteen suns.

When Dharmdas saw the Satya Purush sitting on the (Takht) throne, he saw that He had that same appearance as that of the Jinda Baba on earth. But here the light of one hair follicle of Supreme God was even more than the light of crore suns and crore moons. The God who had gone from earth in Jinda form started swaying a whisk on his other image seated on the throne. Dharmdas thought that Jinda must be a servant of this Supreme God, but they resemble each other. After some time, the God sitting on the throne got up and Jinda sat down on the throne. God with the effulgent body merged into the body of Jinda. Dharmdas felt deeply ashamed. He started cursing himself that - 'How evil I am. I caused so much grief to God, insulted Him so much. I did not believe Him there.'

When the devotees brought him back after showing him God, Dharmdas stayed in God's Satlok for three days. On the other hand, seeing Dharmdas unconscious for three days, the village people, relatives, and friends gathered at Dharmdas's house. Some were getting exorcism performed; some were getting him treated by a doctor, but all the remedies had failed. Everybody had lost hope that Dharmdas will become alive.

On the third day, God put his soul back into his body. People had lifted Dharmdas from the garden, from where God had taken him to Satyalok, and brought him home. Dharmdas regained consciousness. On regaining consciousness, when Dharmdas went back to that place in the garden, the same God was sitting in the form of Jinda Baba there. Dharmdas fell at his feet and said - 'O God! Please forgive the ignorant me, Lord! :-

"Avgun mere Baap ji, baksho garib nivaaj | Jo main poot kapoot hun, bahur Pita ko laaj |"

I did not believe that you are God; you are Param Akshar Brahm. Sometimes, my soul did use to say that who can deliver such knowledge on earth other than the Complete God, but my mind immediately used to present conflicting thoughts. O Satya Purush! Why have you not made that splendour of your body, which is in Satyalok, visible here?'

Supreme God said - 'Dharmdas! If I come to this Kaal Lok in that same radiant body, Kshar Purush (he is also called Jyoti Niranjan) will become anxious. I do all my work secretively. He considers me to be a saint with spiritual powers (siddhis). But he does not know from where I have come. Who am I?'

Supreme God asked Dharmdas - 'How did you find my place?' Dharmdas said - 'O Supreme God! I do not feel like living in this world now. Compared to that sacred place, this entire Lok of Kaal (the area of 21 brahmands) seems like hell. Birth and death are a hard and fast rule here. It is also mandatory to live lives of eighty-four lakh types of living beings. Every person is alive with this very hope that I will not die just now, but still he or she dies anytime. Every person talks deceitfully with one another. But in your Satyalok, all the people talk politely. They behave honestly. I had investigated this only for three days.'

If Dharmdas had not seen his relatives, who were witness of his regaining consciousness, at home, he would have thought that he saw a dream, but now he had firm faith.

(The abovementioned description is in Holy Kabir Sagar Chapter "Gyan Prakash" on Page 57-58, "Mohammad Bodh" on Page 20-21, Dash Muqami Rekhta "Gyan Sthiti Bodh" on Page 83, "Amar Mool" on Page 202.)

"Can One Change Guru?"

Dharmdas asked a question.

Quesion 52 (of Dharmdas):- 'O Lord, can one change guru? I have heard from saints that one should not change guru. Guru ek, Gyan anek - One guru, diverse knowledge.'

Answer (of Satya Purush): -

'Jab tak guru miley nahin sacha, tab tak guru karo das pancha |
Kabir jhoothey guru ke paksh ko, tajat na lagae vaar | Dwaar na paavae moksh ka, reh vaar ka vaar ||

Meaning - Until one finds a true guru (Satguru), one must keep changing gurus. No matter how many gurus one has to acquire and change. One should immediately abandon a fake guru.

Kabir, doobae the par ubhrey, guru ke gyan chamak | Beda dekha jarjara, utar chaley phadak ||

Meaning: - When I found a true guru, I found out with the torch of his knowledge that our knowledge and the solution (way of worship) - both are wrong. So, I changed the guru just as an animal runs very swiftly when frightened, and just as if passengers travelling at night find out in the morning that the boat in which they are travelling has water entering into it and there is a safe and intact boat standing next to it, then a wise passenger who is not intoxicated immediately abandoning the broken boat sits in the leak-proof boat. When I heard this knowledge of True Guru Kabir in Kashi that I have narrated to you, I did not consider caste or religion. I immediately surrendered to the Satguru, and after taking intiation-mantra, I am doing bhakti now. Satguru has ordered me to give initiation. O Dharmdas! Just think, if an ill person does not become healthy from the treatment of a doctor, then does he or she not go to another doctor?'

Dharmdas said - 'One does go, and one should go; one should save one's life.'

Supreme God said - 'Likewise, a human life is obtained for the welfare of the soul. A soul is inflicted with the chronic illness of birth and death. This cannot be terminated without the Satyanaam and Saarnaam. Both these mantras are available from Satguru Kabir who lives in Kashi. No one else on earth has these mantras. You may go to Kashi and take initiation. You would be salvaged, because without Satguru, one cannot go to that Satyalok of mine.'

Dharmdas said - 'You are yourself Satya Purush. Now I would not be misled. You are disguising yourself. O Lord! I have taken intiation from Guru Roopdas ji. I will first take permission from him to change guru. If he will allow me, then I will change guru.' But seeing the limit of foolishness of Dharmdas, Supreme God disappeared the sixth time.

Dharmdas again became distraught. He first went to Roopdas ji who was a worshipper of Shri Krishna i.e. Shri Vishnu. He was associated with Vaishnav Panth. Dharmdas narrated the entire account to Saint Roopdas and asked for permission to change guru. Saint Roopdas ji was a noble soul. He said - 'Son Dharmdas! The knowledge that you have heard from that Jinda Baba, only God can impart such knowledge. I have become very old. I cannot abandon this path. If you wish, you can take intiation from that Mahatma.' Then Dharmdas went to Kashi. There he enquired about the hut of Weaver Kabir. He was struck with amazement on seeing Supreme God Kabir weaving clothes there. He was also immensely delighted to see that he only is the Satguru and the Supreme God. Then Dharmdas took initiation from him and got his welfare done.

Supreme God Kabir then gave Satyanaam of two words (in which one is 'Om' mantra and other is 'Tat' which is coded) to Dharmdas. Then, by giving him Saarnaam, He made him resident of Satlok.